Finest quality percussion revolvers?

Jappo said:

I bought one, of all places ebay. Bought the complete frame. The person later listed the cylinder and I bought it too. I did shoot it with a Pietta cylinder before I got the Santa Barbara cylinder. So I know the Pietta cylinder will interchange with it. Don’t know about other parts. It shoots high just like any other black powder revolver.

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I have bid on a few over the years but I'm not a big 1858 guy anyway, so I let them go to someone else

Stantheman86 said:

I have bid on a few over the years but I'm not a big 1858 guy anyway, so I let them go to someone else

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Yeah I’ve bid on a few myself. But they go way too high for me. I have 3 Pietta, two are 36 caliber Navy

Uncle Miltie said:

We already have one: the Pedersoli 1858 Pattern Remington. But folks in the US are too cheap to buy one.

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Someone is buying $2-3000 Peacemaker clones. I honestly think the Colt mystique and the cool looking Open Tops would sell guns in that price range

Americans are very cheap, it's that small Demographic that buys the high end niche stuff

1858s are too plain Jane for the "cool guy" $2000 revolver Demographic . People want Colts and all the Wild West - Civil War stuff that you get with it

Pedersoli target 1858s for competitive shooting don't trigger American high end gun buyers emotional "take my money" mode which is how I'd be if by some miracle a company like this tries out the market for a Colt cap and baller

I'm the opposite, I 'd rather spend $2000-$3000 for a very well made modern gun than an antique that I'm afraid to shoot. Which is why I own all sorts of USFA's and a Standard, rather than antique Colt's. That said, we can't get Standard to offer more than just the .45Colt, so I don't think I'd hold my breath for a percussion gun.

No, like I said, if you want a very fine percussion gun, send a Uberti to 45D, let him do the works to it then send it to Turnbull for finish work. It will be worth it.

$2000 isn't even a lot in today's Gun Buying World

Seeing a high end reproduction percussion revolver is probably pretty much a pipe dream, unless unfortunately the political climate gets worse, laws limiting purchases to 50 rounds of ammo are passed, or serializing each round or some other nonsense......and the Govt appears to remain kinda loose on Blackpowder firearms, powder and caps........THEN people will clamor for "high end" or "name brand" front stuffer revolvers . Ruger will crank out percussion GP100s and we'll see some weird firearms technology twist with percussion firearms being in mainstream demand as we slowly turn into Europe with our gun laws. If creepy Joe wins 2024 there won't be a round of ammo, a percussion cap, a pound of powder or even a lead round ball to be found anywhere.....But that's a topic for another place.

I personally just buy box stock Italian repros and just shoot them as much as I possibly can, and let them break in to themselves. I'll change nipples and Polish up internals, etc but I mean it's not rocket science, if I can do it anyone can. My two "Grade B" Pietta brassers ran like cartridge guns for nearly 100 rounds a piece after Treso nipples , wool wads with lube in them and a little "fluff and buff" on the hammer and arbor.

And all of them function and fire just fine with the little things I've learned over the years. I'm easily past 5000 rounds through my Uberti London Navy over the past 15 years and it's going strong. Just spend some time with them and they'll tell you what they need and that applies to any firearm.

Everyone is different, I'd rather just be able to buy 1 or 2 cap and ballers that are 100% right out of the box, and just shoot them without "workarounds " , tweaking, sending them to a guy, etc

Uncle Miltie said:

We already have one: the Pedersoli 1858 Pattern Remington. But folks in the US are too cheap to buy one.

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Four of the six vendors that carry them don’t have any stock. Hard to sell something you don’t have and can’t say when you will have.

Stantheman86 said:

Someone is buying $2-3000 Peacemaker clones. I honestly think the Colt mystique and the cool looking Open Tops would sell guns in that price range

Americans are very cheap, it's that small Demographic that buys the high end niche stuff

1858s are too plain Jane for the "cool guy" $2000 revolver Demographic . People want Colts and all the Wild West - Civil War stuff that you get with it

Pedersoli target 1858s for competitive shooting don't trigger American high end gun buyers emotional "take my money" mode which is how I'd be if by some miracle a company like this tries out the market for a Colt cap and baller

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This! ^^^ Colt has a name and cachet that Remington has never had. Of all of the people I know who shoot cap and ball and Single Action revolvers, Colts are just more popular. I like the Remington design just fine, sadly, Pietta doesn seem to care that the chambers are a mismatch to the bore but Pietta or Uberti it really doesn’t matter because neither fit my hand. I’m not alone here. The 1851/SAA grip frame is much better and the 1860 is almost perfect. For cap and ball recoil levels it is perfect. Honestly, I like the Uberti and Second Generation Colts just fine but if there was a higher grade on a level with the Standard Manufacturing SAA, I couldn’t get my wallet out fast enough.

Bad Karma said:

Four of the six vendors that carry them don’t have any stock. Hard to sell something you don’t have and can’t say when you will have.

This! ^^^ Colt has a name and cachet that Remington has never had. Of all of the people I know who shoot cap and ball and Single Action revolvers, Colts are just more popular. I like the Remington design just fine, sadly, Pietta doesn seem to care that the chambers are a mismatch to the bore but Pietta or Uberti it really doesn’t matter because neither fit my hand. I’m not alone here. The 1851/SAA grip frame is much better and the 1860 is almost perfect. For cap and ball recoil levels it is perfect. Honestly, I like the Uberti and Second Generation Colts just fine but if there was a higher grade on a level with the Standard Manufacturing SAA, I couldn’t get my wallet out fast enough.

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Even if a company like Standard Manufacturing focused on 1 revolver, maybe the 1860 Army, there would be enough interest to sell them

It has all the Civil War, early West , Indian Wars cool factor, I honestly don't see why they wouldn't at least think about it . They could even contract with TotW who already makes Colt thread nipples to save having to make them.

The Colt mystique will never die, I paid double the cost of a Uberti for my C Series 2nd Gen Colt Navy just so I can say it's a Colt .

People will pay 2 grand to be able to say their 1860 Army isn't an Italian repro , I would also tear my pants getting my wallet out if I saw this company list one

I doubt if $2000 revolvers will sell enough to make it worthwhile to tool up to make them. We've been spoiled with the Italian repros for so long it would be hard to convince most to drop 2k on one revolver.
Another factor against it is the perception that these are range TOYS. Kinda like airguns in this country. They're looked at as toys, while in Europe they're taken as serious arms.
There's a segment of shooters that take them serious and would spend the money, I just don't know if there's enough. Me, spend 2k on one revolver? Nope. Now, if USFA was still in business, and could sell them for half that, sure, put me down for a 51 Navy and a 60 army, I can justify that.

Pete453 said:

I doubt if $2000 revolvers will sell enough to make it worthwhile to tool up to make them. We've been spoiled with the Italian repros for so long it would be hard to convince most to drop 2k on one revolver.
Another factor against it is the perception that these are range TOYS. Kinda like airguns in this country. They're looked at as toys, while in Europe they're taken as serious arms.
There's a segment of shooters that take them serious and would spend the money, I just don't know if there's enough. Me, spend 2k on one revolver? Nope. Now, if USFA was still in business, and could sell them for half that, sure, put me down for a 51 Navy and a 60 army, I can justify that.

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They would be part of the quiet niche market where they would sell enough to be profitable , even if it's only 10 per month . That's $20,000 , minus overhead

I don't think Romano sells tons of $4000 Tarpley carbines or Tyler Texas rifles but they're a small Operation and they're still around . They appeal to a very small customer base. $1000 will buy you a Pedersoli Cook & Brother rifle or $5000 will buy you a hand fitted Tyler Texas rifle from Romano. 95 people out of 100 will take the Pedersoli but Romano stays in business from that 5% that will lay out big $$ for the best

If I wanted to get a divorce, which I don’t, all I would need to do is buy a $5,000 rifle.

Stantheman86 said:

They would be part of the quiet niche market where they would sell enough to be profitable , even if it's only 10 per month . That's $20,000 , minus overhead

I don't think Romano sells tons of $4000 Tarpley carbines or Tyler Texas rifles but they're a small Operation and they're still around . They appeal to a very small customer base. $1000 will buy you a Pedersoli Cook & Brother rifle or $5000 will buy you a hand fitted Tyler Texas rifle from Romano. 95 people out of 100 will take the Pedersoli but Romano stays in business from that 5% that will lay out big $$ for the best

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“The 2nd Generation (C Series and F Series) lasted for over a decade and included a total of 11 different designs 1851 Navy; 1847 Walker; First, Second and Third Model Dragoons; 1860 Army with rebated cylinder and fluted cylinder; 1861 Navy; 1848 Baby Dragoon, and 1862 Pocket Police and Pocket Navy.

"The best seller was the 1860 Army, just slightly ahead of the 1851 Navy in popularity," recalls Imperato.”

Times have changed but American shooters still understand and value quality and timeless design. I don’t know how many 2nd Generation revolvers were produced, that book is packed away and I don’t have time to dig it out at the moment. I do know it was a bunch over a decade of production and they were sold at a premium price for the day. Standard has focused on a couple of iconic Colt pistols in the two original calibers and configurations and then built them to the standard of a Swiss watch. A friend was given one on the occasion of his retirement from the Sheriffs Department. I’ve never seen it but he says other than his original Cavalry Colt it’s the only SAA he’ll never sell. I do need to make the trip. To see an old friend and to find out what the buzz is all about.

Some fellas like @GYJ have wanted them to expand the line to other calibers and configurations which is fine but they already build something that no one else does. A virtually exact replica of the original Colt SAA. Made of materials, with fit and finish that Colt could only dream of. Would it raise the price to offer other calibers? Would they have to cut corners? Don’t know. But if a better than original .45 Colt SAA doesn’t do it for you?

TDM said:

If I wanted to get a divorce, which I don’t, all I would need to do is buy a $5,000 rifle.

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My better half once bought me a fine condition Merwin & Hulbert .44-40 because I’d spent a half an hour at the seller’s table examining the gun. She knew I wouldn’t spend the money myself so she did it for me. (Have I mentioned I married up? Way up!)

Stantheman86 said:

I'll change nipples and Polish up internals, etc but I mean it's not rocket science, if I can do it anyone can.

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And that is the main difference. It's all about knowing WHAT to do to WHAT !! Everybody thinks they're a tuner when they aren't!! Lol!!
If you have some sandpaper and a Dremel, you're Jim Martin!!

It's not the point you're making, but Cold Mountain was a good civil war movie from the perspective of the CSA.

US Firearms was a company active in the early 2000's. I'm not sure when they got started, maybe in the 1990's, but they only lasted a few years. They operated out of the actual original Colt factory, "under the Blue Dome." They made excellent single action cartridge revolvers which were clones of the old Colts. I have a couple of them and they are nice. A lot of competitive shooters liked them better than Colts, and they were definitely better finished than the Italian revolvers being made at that time. I spoke with their rep at one of the SHOT Shows and also at the first SASS convention. They had plans to make percussion revolvers, and even went so far as to publish a little period-looking manual for the cap & ballers. Oddly, they enclosed one of those percussion revolver books with a .38 Special Model P that I bought from them once. However, I think they just took on too much. The Omni revolver, for one thing, and I think a semi-auto, then a weird .22, and they had plans for a Merwin & Hulbert and an 1875 Remington. In any event, I think they lost their focus, and then they lost their shirt. Another one gone under.

They made some good guns. If they had just stuck with the Colts, and maybe added a couple of cap & ball pistols and possibly an open top, people would have bought every one. As it is, we have the Italian guns and the competition between the Italian builders seems to be keeping the quality up.

"It ain't like it used to be, but it'll do."

Notchy Bob

Bushfire said:

It's not the point you're making, but Cold Mountain was a good civil war movie from the perspective of the CSA.

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It is to my knowledge the only movie that has a depiction of the Battle of the Crater

I hope you guys are right, but for now I'll have to make do with Ubertis.

Speaking for myself, I almost didn't even buy the Standard (center) because the .45Colt has become sort of a milquetoast, overly popular cartridge and I can't ignore its caveats like most its fans seem to do. The USFA Pre-war (left) is a .44Spl, while the 3rd generation Colt (right) is a .38-40 and to me those are much more interesting cartridges.




USFA did try to take on too much but it wasn't too many guns, it was too many aspects of production. They were even making their own screws and doing all their finish work at the end. They didn't "go under", Doug Donnelly just decided he didn't want to do it any more. In my opinion, the market couldn't bear a SAA replica that cost as much as a "real Colt", even though it was 10x better. Too many people said they'd rather buy "the real thing" even though it was vastly inferior. Which never made sense to me. USFA's were also lower than they should've been. The above model was selling for $1200 with a finish Colt hadn't offered since before WWII and they should've been $2000. Their standard SAA, finished with hot salt blue like the post-war Colt SAA's was only $900. I just about guarantee they lost money on every gun they made. Which is a real shame because the domestic guns were absolutely fabulous in every way.

It's based on those lessons that I don't think the market would support a super premium percussion gun or Colt cartridge conversion. Don't get me wrong, I'd LOVE IT if they did, I just don't think the market is there.

I Don’t think Standard Manufacturing would even wast their time they already make a shotgun and a 1911 along with the single Action and in todays crumbling financial market they’re having trouble getting buyers now as it is.

Maybe back in the day they just 'aimed' at the belt buckle and hoped the round would hit the 'breadbasket'!