1848 Military Service Load

[rodwha]

So I’m a bit curious what the service loads for the military were for the Colt 1848 Dragoon was. Do we know whether or not it was fed 2F or 3F? I’m guessing during the Civil War these loads may have varied much like we see with the smaller .44’s and the .36’s.

 

[rodwha]

I’m guessing the Johnston & Dow cartridge was for the Dragoon since that’s a hefty bullet sitting on a hefty powder charge, though I know the Hazard’s cartridge has a similar powder charge, though shown to be 4F (which wouldn’t take up the volume 3 or 2F would of course).



What were the ram’s face like? A ball and a pointy conical are very different. If the ram was concave it would blunt the point

 

[hawkeye2]

Was the government even providing prepared cartridges for the Dragoons during the Civil War? I have never seen any reference to them though I never looked for anything except the Navy and Army revolvers.

 

[Grenadier1758]

I recently measured three 36 caliber revolvers. The mouths of the cylinders measured 0.378" in diameter. These pistols all bear proof marks pre 1980. Once again I want to emphasize the importance of measuring items. Per the Dixie Gun Works recommendation, the 0.376" ball would slide in a d would not seal the chamber mouth. I use 0.380" balls in the 36 caliber revolvers.

 

[Gun Tramp]

"Directions for Loading and Managing Colt's Pistols" gives 1 1/2 drachms (41 grains) as the "Quantity of Powder" for the "Cavalry or Holster pistols." This appears to be a civilian broadsheet and does not specify whether the ball is round or conical. A similar London broadsheet suggests "Fine-grain Powder the best."

 

[rodwha]

Was the government even providing prepared cartridges for the Dragoons during the Civil War? I have never seen any reference to them though I never looked for anything except the Navy and Army revolvers.

I’m guessing so as it seems that Johnson & Dow load has too much lead and powder for the .44’s that came around the 60’s. Assuming the repros are fairly close in chamber volume I have found my NMA will be close to maxed out with its 30 grn charge of 3F Olde E that weighs around 33 grns with what I’m assuming will be a roughly 215 grn WFN bullet (I’ve allowed 1/16” for an over powder card, 1/16” to keep the bullet from being flush as gas cutting will eat it, and another 1/16” for variation in powder charge). This doesn’t quite match up with the Hazard’s cartridge so I’m guessing the originals had a little more room or their 4F charge was by weight as that pointy bullet must be long, certainly longer than my WFN design.

However I can’t say I’m familiar with all of the various conical designs. It seems all of the pictures I’ve seen shows them as quite pointy which would make them fairly long for their weight.

 

[Smokey Plainsman]

 

[rodwha]

Maybe the government was a little trepidatious after Walker cylinders burst?

Would 30 grns and a ball not leave a gap in a cylinder that would hold 50 plus a ball?

 

[hawkeye2]

The Walker was never used as a standard firearm by the US government so we can dismiss that however the Dragoons were but I have no idea how many saw service in the Civil War. The later Colts, Remingtons and others were far more manageable and saw extensive use during the conflict. At one time I did a fair amount of research into Civil War revolver ammo packets and the wooden boxes they were shipped in and never found any of either for the Dragoons. I would suggest anyone wanting to know what the issue charge was to search the 1848 to 1860 period.

 

[bang]

Pretty much think in times of war one didn't care if it was 20 or 50 as long as it fired.
Without research and considering the military rifles I've read about stated 60 as military load I can't see the load for say an 1858 being less but not much over 20.

 

[Zonie]

The Walker was never used as a standard firearm by the US government so we can dismiss that however the Dragoons were but I have no idea how many saw service in the Civil War....

I don't know how many Colt Dragoons were used in the Civil War but, "FLAYDERMAN'S GUIDE TO ANTIQUE AMERICAN FIREARMS" says there were approx 7,300 First Model Dragoons, 2,700 Second Model Dragoons and 10,500 Third Model Dragoons made between 1848 and 1861. That adds up to about 20,500 total.

 

[bang]

Thinking in military logistics I would not expect a well supplied army, particularly of the time frame would purchase or issue any arms that went over their established range, powder consumption or ammo compatibility.
An example was the study of black powder use in artillery. Hypothetically if 1lb of powder reached a range of x and 2lbs reached a range of x.25 there wasn't much since in using 2lbs. Those results followed a pattern regardless of bore. The end results were understanding that black powder in it's use of straight front loaded bores had equal pressure limits across the spectrum.
So why would you use but what would get the job done and at the same time be efficient.
Some on Confederate side may have used Dragoons because it was what they personally had. Keeping enough powder to max out the load probably was another thing. I could imagine a supply Sargent hearing, that's not enough powder allotment, I carry a Dragoon. I'm sure the reply would be, don't put so much in it.
Think similar applies to why Navy chose 36cal. 5lbs of lead makes more ball than 44s but at the range used is sufficient plus 15-28 gns of powder means more for the cannon.
Bottom line is efficient but effective use.