1849 Colt cylinder question

[ToothPick]

A few years ago I picked this numbers matching 1849 Colt up at a local gun show. It is not 100% Reliable or in the greatest shape but the price was right and I thought it would be fun to shoot.

The problem is the 5 shot cylinder will only rotate 3 or 4 times. I believe the cylinder "ratchets"? are worn down on 2 of them. It is always the same ones that hang up.

I was thinking of buying a Uberti cylinder and seeing if I could make that work. (I would keep the old one of course.)

Has anyone had any luck swapping out a old cylinder? Any know of a reliable seller of reproduction parts?

Thanks

The grips are perfect and the finish is really gray, not the dark color shown.

You can see the worn ratchets

The rifling is still there

 

[Grumpa]

Probably just displaying my ignorance here...but would it be possible to weld up the worn ratchets, and have them recut? :idunno:

 

[ToothPick]

I would think ( not sure) that welding the original cylinder would really hurt the value and cost a bit to do.


Then again maybe it doesn't have that much value to begin with if it doesn't function 100% ??????

I was thinking about getting a $85 Uberti cylinder and see if it work.

 

[azmntman]

Nice find!

If the new cyl dont work I guess you wil have to buy the pistol too! :thumbsup:

 

[pargent]

Leave the original old COLT alone , buy a repro and get a chubby by f....ng that up to your hearts content , you are going to ruin a 150+ year old gun just to shoot it and burst the cylinder . :idunno: :shake: :nono: :cursing:

 

[pargent]

Brutal yes but it needs to be said none the less .

 

[MacRob46]

Are you planning to shoot this gun? If not, then leave it alone. An all matching number Colt 1849 has some collector's value even in what appears from your photo to be less than perfect condition. Buy a repro and fool with it, as has already been suggested. Heck, you even have a good bore in your revolver. Don't screw it up by trying to drop in a reproduction cylinder which probably won't fit any way!!!!!!

 

[denster]

Leave the original old COLT alone , buy a repro and get a chubby by f....ng that up to your hearts content , you are going to ruin a 150+ year old gun just to shoot it and burst the cylinder . :idunno: :shake: :nono: :cursing:

Would this have been less effective if presented in a civil manner?

 

[ToothPick]

Ok, maybe you meant well, but please enlighten me as to what part of the original gun gets f'ed with by dropping in a new cylinder? Would not the only fitting (if any) be done to the new cylinder and not the gun itself? < that was my question.

I asked this question because I don't know and was hoping someone who actually did a cylinder swap might chime in.

If I wanted advise about if turning a wall hanger back in to a shooter was a good idea or not, then I would of stated my question that way. To me, in this condition, it is nothing more then a pricey & cool looking prop gun and might as well be made by Denix. At least I am not parting it out on ebay like I see every day.

Of course I will not alter the original gun but I would like to enjoy shooting it with light loads, only if that is possible with doing a cylinder swap.

SO I will ask it this way, has anyone swapped out a repro cylinder successfully with out having to alter the original gun?

Thanks

P.S. Burst the cylinder?????? Where did that come from???? The whole post was about replacing the original cylinder with a new steel one?????

 

[denster]

Since the only maker of a replica 1849 is Uberti maybe someone on here who has one can measure the arbor diameter, the overall cylinder diameter and the overall length of the cylinder measured over the ratchet to the face. Those dimensions could be compared to your revolver to see if an interchange is possible. Remember metal can be removed but darn hard to add back on.
If all of those dimensions are compatible the only other thing to be concerned with is the distance between the centerline of the arbor hole and the centerline of a chamber. That dimension would need to be nearly identical.

 

[MacRob46]

Jim...

I guess my comment stems from not being able to understand why anyone, and not just you, would want to do what you have outlined. There are plenty of quality repro revolvers out there which will allow you to experience the fun of shooting a cap and ball gun without monkeying around with a scarce and getting scarcer, original. If we did not have that sort of thing available I could understand why you would want to shoot an original and a lot of them have been. I don't know about fitting a new cylinder to the gun but as I said in my first post, I certainly doubt you will find one that will simply drop in. There are other posts on the forum from members who bought spare cylinders for reproduction guns and found that they did not fit.

 

[huntinguy]

There are folks out there that will make you a new cylinder. I can't think of any off hand but if you search for cartridge conversions you will find at least two makers of custom cylinders. I would contact them and see what they can do for you.

As for welding up the cylinder, there are a hand full of smiths that can restore an original pistol back to functioning condition (my brother had one done).

In either event it will not be cheap...

as for fitting a production cylinder. IF you could get a first generation Uberti cylinder you may have a chance. The first production run was made on the original Colt tooling. A first gen cylinder will cost you more than a new pistol.

I believe the second generation and later were retooled to meet modern production standards and all the dimensions were changed.

This is were bad happens, the new cylinders MAY have different dimensions, such as the chambers may be on a different radius and that could line the ball up with the edge of the barrel. That would mean firing would not put the ball into the bore but the metal of the barrel. At that point you could ruin the gun or your hand.

You need to talk to some one like Hunter Restoration. Don't go to your local gunsmith, it has to be someone who knows black powder and percussion revolvers.

You are a lucky man to have such a pistol.

 

[crockett]

Answer is no but are you sure you can't get what you have operational? If you mark or number the chambers, does the cylinder rotate okay on some but then jams on others (always the same chambers that jam?) I had that problem and what had happened was a bur on a particular ratchet tooth got raised up. It was preventing me from cocking the hammer back- if that sounds familiar to your situation. If you file it off- that works but a good gunsmith might be able to peen hammer the tooth back to original shape and not remove any metal.
Off hand, I can't think of any trouble that would occur from using a new cylinder. If you go that route maybe buy a new hand because the cost is cheap, maybe a new bolt as well. If you save the original parts- still have the collector value aspect.

 

[ToothPick]

A big thank you to the posters above me. Great info.

That is the information I wanted. Sorry if I was a little cranky this morning.

Since it now appears that it is not practical or easy, I will pass on the new cylinder.

If I do decide to sell it to finance some modern gun purchases, what do you think a colt in this condition can expect to bring? Even a ball park estimate would be appreciated.

Again, numbers matching , OK bore, great grips and grey metal finish with assorted dings and 2 or more worn cylinder ratchets and at least 2 replacement screws.

Thanks

Here are 2 little better pictures

 

[ToothPick]

these are better...less glare

 

[denster]

Just curious. Have you had this checked out to verify that it is an original? Hard to tell from the photos but there are a few things that don't appear quite right.

 

[ToothPick]

No I haven't,,,but what does not look right to you?

Here are some close ups, ...you can still see traces of silver plating on some pics.

If someone faked this gun they did a great job.

 

[denster]

Much better. Guess it was the positioning and the lighting in the earlier photos.

 

[ToothPick]

WHEW...had me worried for a bit.

It's tough for me to get good photo's inside and with my limited skills. Seems so much easier to get nice pics when the sun is shining.

Thanks

 

[M. De Land]

If it where mine I'd make it function correctly as the ratchet teeth look to me like they could be cleaned up and salvaged to functionality without any TIG welding.
The original hand may need a bit of stretching and tuning up as well and the barrel set back but it looks repairable to me without changing any parts out.