.45 cal ML Pistol

[luieb45]

My uncle has a .45 cal ml pistol that he is letting me borrow to shoot and I have .45 cal balls, patches, and cleaning jags but the only powder I have is pyrodex rs and goex pinnacle. Will pyrodex rs work in this pistol if I load it lightly at about 20-30 grains. I am new to all types of pistols and haven't really ever shot one let alone a muzzleloading pistol. Thanks.

 

[Zonie]

You didn't say if the pistol is a caplock or a flintlock.

Assuming it is a cap lock and you have caps that fit its nipple either of those synthetic black powders will work.
In a .45, a 20-30 grain load will work just fine.

You said you had some .45 caliber balls.
If these are .451, .453, .457...anything larger than .450 they probably won't fit in the pistol.

A .45 caliber pistol really needs .440 or .445 diameter balls. That is because the patch has some thickness so the ball must be slightly undersize.

Even being undersized, when you add in twice the thickness of the patch (there's patching on both sides of the ball) you will need something to start it into the bore. If you don't have a short starter a non-metallic mallet will work.

If you want to try loading a .451 diameter ball without a patch you will have to hammer it in to start it and after it is started it may ram rather easily. That can be a problem because if it is too loose it may move forward off of the powder charge if the muzzle is pointed downward before firing.
Also, an unpatched ball will give very poor accuracy and it may leave lead in the barrel.

Hope this helps.

PS: If the gun is a Flintlock it must have real black powder to work. The synthetic black powders may fire once in a while but generally speaking they all work very poorly in a Flintlock.

 

[luieb45]

The pistol is a caplock with a #11 nipple which I have PLENTY of caps for. I have .010 patches in two brands and some pillow ticking patches for .50 cal which I cut around the edges a little to fit it better. The balls I have are .440 and .433. I had to mess around with all of that on my .45 cal rifle which has an undersized bore. I am going to have to clean the gun with a rifle cleaning rod which will be annoying. But it will work. What would be my heaviest powder charge with the pyrodex rs if I were to use it as a side arm while hunting?

 

[Zonie]

No offense meant but I wonder why everyone is always wondering what the maximum load they can use is? Oh well.

Your .45 is probably safe with up to a powder load of 40 grains.

Bear in mind that the Lyman Black Powder Handbook & Loading Manual does not show any powder load higher than 30 grains in their .45 Single Shot Pistol tests.
They stopped at 30 grains and the breech pressure shooting a .440 diameter roundball with that amount of powder was 6,500 psi (GOEX 3Fg) and 7,200 psi (Pyrodex P).

I'm betting that the breech pressure was not the reason they quit at 30 grains of powder.
Using powder loads larger than that in a short barreled pistol (8 inch in the Lyman tests) is a waste of powder (IMO) unless the purpose is to WOW the viewing public who like to see large balls of flame coming out of a gun.

 

[luieb45]

With about 30-40 grains of pyrodex how fast is that ball going to be moving? I want to carry this as a sidearm while I'm hunting and won't be shooting at deer if the ball is only moving about 800 fps.

 

[redwing]

These are not .44 Mags. but the soft lead ball will do a lot of damage with 40 Grs, of powder. The number one reason you see so many pistols with stocks cracked around the base of the barrels is due to the heavy powder charges. :shake:

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

My uncle has a .45 cal ml pistol that he is letting me borrow to shoot and I have .45 cal balls, patches, and cleaning jags but the only powder I have is pyrodex rs and goex pinnacle. Will pyrodex rs work in this pistol if I load it lightly at about 20-30 grains. I am new to all types of pistols and haven't really ever shot one let alone a muzzleloading pistol. Thanks.

Please don't take this the wrong way, but UNTIL you learn how to shoot a pistol, PLEASE don't take one hunting, let alone with a Max charge. Just because you can, doesn't mean that you SHOULD! For safety's sake, get to know how to operate a pistol before going into the field with one.

Since this is your first and only pistol, perhaps you may want to consider buying a .22 and putting a couple bricks (500 rounds each) through it so you can become proficient with a hand gun. Then and only then should you take a hand gun into the woods for hunting purposes, IMHO.

Until then, concentrate on the mechanics of not blowing-up the gun or yourself, or "crossing yourself" with a loaded and capped hand gun.

Have fun with this loaner and get to know it's idiosyncrasies.

Dave

 

[luieb45]

So would 30 grains go completely through a deer? I was talking about using it as a sidearm next year since I am done deer hunting for the year since I am tagged out.

 

[renovato]

So would 30 grains go completely through a deer? I was talking about using it as a sidearm next year since I am done deer hunting for the year since I am tagged out.

Extremely unlikely, even if it's a small deer. Black powder handguns just aren't all that powerful. The barrels are just too short to get a lot of velocity from the limited amount of powder that they can burn.

 

[44-henry]

I would also highly discourage you from taking that gun out hunting based on your previous comments. Hunting with a handgun can be fun (I do it all the time) but you really must develop a lot of skill before it is ethical to take one out after game. I don't even know if the laws in your state would allow a .45 caliber muzzleloading pistol for deer, but it wouldn't be my first choice even if legal. It certainly would kill a deer with a 40 grain charge, but you would have to very carefully pick your shot (being willing to pass up all but perfect presentations). From a hunting position you have to be capable of keeping all your shots within an 8" bull (5-6" would be better) at the range you choose to hunt at. My advice would be to practice with the pistol, get really good with it, and than get yourself something more potent and learn to use that before going into the field with it. Crippling an animal is a very likely possiblity otherwise and no ethical hunter would ever willingly engage in acts that make that a likely scenario.

 

[luieb45]

I would also highly discourage you from taking that gun out hunting based on your previous comments. Hunting with a handgun can be fun (I do it all the time) but you really must develop a lot of skill before it is ethical to take one out after game. I don't even know if the laws in your state would allow a .45 caliber muzzleloading pistol for deer, but it wouldn't be my first choice even if legal. It certainly would kill a deer with a 40 grain charge, but you would have to very carefully pick your shot (being willing to pass up all but perfect presentations). From a hunting position you have to be capable of keeping all your shots within an 8" bull (5-6" would be better) at the range you choose to hunt at. My advice would be to practice with the pistol, get really good with it, and than get yourself something more potent and learn to use that before going into the field with it. Crippling an animal is a very likely possiblity otherwise and no ethical hunter would ever willingly engage in acts that make that a likely scenario.

I was more talking if I had already hit the deer and the deer paused for another shot. 2 bullets in a deer is better than one.

 

[Zonie]

Before you said you were thinking of using your pistol as a 2nd shot at rifle distances I was going to say that Leman was getting 1104 fps muzzle velocity using 30 grains of GOEX 3Fg powder under their patched .440 ball.

That velocity at 15 yards range is 1037 fps which is more than enough to finish off a deer if the shot is in the right place.

At 75 yards though the velocity of the pistols ball will have fallen down to about 845 fps with about 220 ft/lbs of energy.

IMO, that's a pretty low value for use on a deer sized critter.

 

[luieb45]

Well I got the pistol. I took a look down the bore and apparently the gun had been shot and not properly cleaned and there was a big spot of pitting in the bore. But also the bore is not rifled. So I am not sure how the gun will shoot and I probably not going to hunt with it ever.