Any point to thin wad between powder and PRB

[JJCASTINGS]

While searching other things, I read somewhere, maybe not here, that putting a thin wad, like the Oxbow stuff used in cap and ball, cut to bore diameter in a rifle and used between the powder and the PRB increases accuracy because it keeps the patch from burning through. I know that experimenting with patch thickness can increase accuracy. But I have never tried the wad idea. Anyone ever hear of this or try it? I have the supplies to make such wads, but did not want to waste any of the felt if it has been proven not to do anything. I would hate to think that a brother BP shooter was just, Blowing Smoke.

 

[Shifty]

I have not tried it yet with a patched round ball,plan on trying it in my pistol,but I know for a fact it really helps with a conical.

 

[jdkerstetter]

.....but I know for a fact it really helps with a conical.

Please explain this. I am curios how one gets obrutration from the conicals skirt with a wad behind it.

Thanks, J.D.

 

[MSW]

For whatever it's worth, i have also heard that putting a bit of leather (soaked in the lube of your choice - bt the secret formulae described in the sacred texts will guarantee success :haha: ) between the powder and PRB will keep the fouling soft, tighten groups, make you thin, handsome (or pretty) attractive in every way, and an honored guest at any homecoming.

gotta give that a try ... :hmm:

 

[Shifty]

Well the conicals I use are not hollow base,maybe the wad helps to seal the bullet ,maybe it keeps the base from eroding from the gases from the powder buring so it can conform to the rifling better, I don't really know,but some time back I was having trouble getting this conical gun of mine to group good enough to hunt with so I posted the the ques on here as to what can I try,and I think RoundBall told me to use the wad and it worked ,went from about 8" group at 50yds to about 2 1/2" group.Sorry I don't have a better answer.

 

[dbutch]

Yes they have tightened groups in 3 different rifles I shoot.
GM .58 cal...GM .54 cal. T/C .54 cal.barrels.
1/8" nitro card or OxYoke 1/8" wool wad..(felt)
I load a wet-damp tight patch....patch weave on rb.
Not all my rifle loads require these...
My smaller calibers don't like them.
If your unhappy with the groups your shooting give them a try.

here's some results....patch only,,1 op card ..2 op cards

op cards = Circle Fly 1/8" nitro card

using .530 home cast rb

6 o clock hold

 

[jdkerstetter]

Well the conicals I use are not hollow base.....

I can see why they would need a wad or some other assistance is getting a good bore seal. You are basically shooting a long naked ball....a slug.

Slug gun shooters paper patch their bullets to ensure a seal.

I guess the question is, why not shoot hollow base conicals in the first place?

Enjoy, J.D.

 

[Vaino]

I shoot mainly PRBs and like to keep it simple...an addt'l something when loading just complicates shooting MLers. Of course, mine are used for hunting and both the PRB and conical loads are accurate for that purpose...even "head hunting" for squirrels.

I can see where a tight fitting over powder wad when using conicals could increase accuracy....just like a "gas check" when shooting lead bullets in a CF rifle which doesn't obturate the bore but prevents gas erosion of the bullet base.....Fred

 

[Little Wattsy]

I do it for hunting... I can not say for 100% sure that it does more then just the .015 patch I use but it sure dosnt hurt... Accuracy is good.
:idunno:

 

[Rifleman1776]

For whatever it's worth, i have also heard that putting a bit of leather (soaked in the lube of your choice - bt the secret formulae described in the sacred texts will guarantee success :haha: ) between the powder and PRB will keep the fouling soft, tighten groups, make you thin, handsome (or pretty) attractive in every way, and an honored guest at any homecoming.

gotta give that a try ... :hmm:

In this game, you will "hear" a lot of things. There are advocates for almost any bizzare notion that someone with no experience can dream up. To some doing things the old way is not acceptable.
I guess, if it's made of plastic or packed in a plastic bubble it is what should be used. :barf:

 

[matt denison]

"used between the powder and the PRB increases accuracy because it keeps the patch from burning through"

If you are using a quality material of the right thickness then patch burn through won't happen with or without a wad. If you need a wad under a PRB to stop your patches from blowing out then you are doing something wrong in the first place. Fix that and forget the wad.

A wad between a greased patched ball and the powder can be a good thing if the gun will be left loaded such as in a hunting situation so the grease doesn't contaminate the powder. That is about the ony good thing for a wad.

Someone posted a lot of info. here in the past about putting all sorts of stuff down the bore and claimed higher velocity, smaller groups, efficient burn rates, clearer complexion and brighter teeth. That info. has now morphed into "must do" for better accuracy. For a smoothbore...maybe. For a tightly patched rifled gun, I call :bull:

However, go try your own experiments and report back. We might all learn something pro or con.

 

[Shifty]

I have a small supply of these flat base conicals now but no hollow base ,but I did have the fiber wads,after I shoot all of these bullets will try the Lee type can't remember the # right now but where suggested to me by idaho ron with the paper patch and will start with 25 % cotton paper, what do you use or suggest.I see some hollow base conicals on Track are they the same as the Lee type?

 

[rodwha]

I have wondered if a dry wad is a good idea to use between a lubed patch (I'm going to first try my Gatofeo lube) and the powder during hunting season as there's no telling how long it may sit there, and I'm not sure if the lube can/will effect the powder.

 

[Shifty]

I think a dry patch would help keep the lube from harming the powder.

 

[Rifleman1776]

not sure

Bingo. The whole issue in a nutshell.
Try, test, experiment, ask experienced ml shooters. Not some guy standing in line at Wal-mart.
A properly lubed patch will not harm powder. A proper patch with a proper lube will not: 'blow-out'; 'burn through'; 'disentegrate'; etc.

 

[JJCASTINGS]

Thanks everyone.

I am not having a patch burn issue. I use 100%cotton pillow ticking. The burn statement was part of what I had read.

I cut all my cap & ball patches from felt I pre-treat with a mix of beeswax & Crisco. Pre-treat puts a nice edge on the punched wads.

I'll do some testing after the holidays and get back to the group.

 

[Clovis]

Well, I don't mean to cause any more trouble with this than it looks like it has already caused, but in my limited experience with my .50's and .45's one oxyoke overpowder wad improved my accuracy some and two improved it more. This seemed especially so in my Seneca with the badly pitted bore where I could see reasonable accuracy that I had not seen in that gun before. I will say all of the barrels I have used this method in are 1/48" but I don't know if this has much to do with the results I am seeing or not. Want everyone to understand I am not a big proponet of this method but these are just my observations and your welcome to experiment on your own and make your own observations.

 

[don hepler]

You might have hit on something, like bore condition, or depth of rifling, or flat or round bottom rifling. How much charge, may affect accuracy. If they did nothing, then how would they sell any.

I don't see any difference in my 36 Seneca, however, I see improvement in my 50 Hawken. Perhaps I could experiment with different patch materials and lubes, but for now the wad over powder shows improvement in accuracy, be it imaginary or real, it works for me.

I got'em, I can afford'em and I'm using them.

 

[George T.]

If I tried it and it worked would I be doing that the rest of my life? I guess that I have a decision to make! Geo. T.

 

[crockett]

I always loaded powder and then a PRB. A few years ago I read an article by Ross Seyfried who writes for GunsAmerica Magazine and he spoke about getting better accuracy by loading powder, then a wad, and then a PRB. I tried it and IMHO it didn't make much difference in my firearms so I forgot it. Others have noticed an improvement in their guns. As far as the wads, since I dropped the thing I haven't recently bought any wads but they did make 50 and 54 caliber wads at least as recent as a few years ago. Some one probably is still making them.