Barrel length, accuracy?

[rabjr]

Just trying to gather info for a possible future project.

I have not participated in our shotgun season for a while now. Mainly because the State still will not allow muzzle loaders during it unless they are smoothbore. Which is dunb concidering shotguns can have rifled barrels now....

I was wondering what one can reasonable expect from a 30" barrel with a rear sight, shooting a .62 ball? At 50 or 75 yards.

Thanks!

 

[Stumpkiller]

What do you get now with an iron-sighted .22 LR at those ranges? Multiply that figure by 6.

With my 42" Bess I could do 7 or 8" at 50 yards on a good day and maybe 12 or 14" at 75. Much past 50 yards it gets to be mostly zen that drives the ball for elevation judgement. On a gentleman's bet with a friend, I put five consecutive shots in a full-sized cardboard cut-out of him at 100 yards. Some weren't pretty, but they all hit above the knees in a disabling fashion. There's a local fellow who could easily put them all in the chest, but he is genetically special or something. (Multiple Olympic Gold in Miquelet (13 shots @ 50M), still holds the world's record 97 from 1985).

If you have a shotgun, get a couple boxes of rifled slugs and head out to the range. (No fair using the buck barrel with sights). That is as close an approximation as you will get in a centerfire. The trajectory is even close.

I have a 28" shotgun barrel for my New Englander, and that will throw round balls into the famous pie-plate out to 60 yards with satisfying regularity. I bought it as a kit for exactly the reason you are asking. That is: I wondered if I could live with the accuracy possible from a Bess I was hoping to have made.

You should do a LOT of practicing before you try a 75 yard shot on a deer. When I hunted with my Bess I treated it as a recurve bow that was a LOT easier top hold at full draw.

 

[RussB]

I was wondering what one can reasonable expect from a 30" barrel with a rear sight, shooting a .62 ball? At 50 or 75 yards.
Thanks!

Swamp Rat...Wish I had some good answers for you, but I don't. It would appear that most folks here are a much better marksman than myself, so I will tell you what my smoothie will do with me driving.
I have a .66 cal, shoot a .648 PRB, in front of 82gr FFg, in a 33" barrel with a very ugly Hawken rear sight. And, if I flinch just right, and get at least one friendly flyer I can get a three shot group, off the bench, that is in the 3" / 5+" neighborhood.
Not much to brag about....however, it is a world of improvement over just six months ago, when I couldn't make paper at 50 yds.
I don't have a lot of experience with the smoothie as I still have over half a can of FFFFg that I prime with. And the rifle it self is not one to brag about, but I do have to admit I feel much better shooting those groups with the smoothie, than I do shooting less than 1" with the Penn Hunter...my most accurate muzzleloader.

In view of what I just said, I would suspect you could do at least that well, and probably much better.
A smoothie is a bit more than just another flinter. I suspect they, at least mine, seem to need a good cussing with lots of reference to their parentage before they start to act right. ::

Russ

 

[Rat]

I have a thin blade front sight on my 31" Bess, and a buckhorn rear sight that I cut a small "U" notch in. It gives me a "fine" sight picture.

With a tight fitting patch, wonder wad, ball seated sprue DOWN, and Swiss ffg powder, she will print 3" groups at 50, and then opens up quite a bit after that, but will stay on a paper plate at 65 to 70 yards.

She'll do pin-wheels at 25 yards...which is kind of fun.

I think if you work at it you can get pretty impressive accuracy from a smoothbore, better than most people think. To do that of course good rifle sights are a must.

:imo:

Rat

 

[rabjr]

Well if I end up with a 50 yard gun, thats not so bad. I've sworn off shotgun season and not getting out there now so...And probably 90% of all my shots taken at deer have been under 60 yards. Definatly something I would like to look into in the near future. Thanks guys.

 

I think a longer musket barrel might be an advantage as to the softer delivery of the ball from the barrel(pressure is lower). Now, with that said, the difference probably isn't as much with RB, as it is with shot. Make no mistake, low muzzle pressure tightens patterns immensly.(which is why many shotguns of 1860 had up to 48" barrels- they shot tighter)
: If you have some sort of centering system at the rear of the barrel as well as a blade sight, a large bore, ie: .72 and above can be made to deliver very good accuracy to 90/100yds. for hunting vry large big game, ie: moose or elk.
; The smaller the ball, the poorer the shooting- generally. Taken to a rather extreme situation, a 32lb.'r is more accurate than a 3" cannon(which have short barrels in ratio, BTW) is more accurate than a .75 musket, therefore a .75 is more accurate than a .62. How much- hard to say, but enough that I have never seen a .62 shoot as well as a .75.I've only seen a dozen or so .62's shoot for score at that range. My bro's 2 Bess'(one .75 and one .77) have both shot into 8" to 12" at 100yds. with up to 120gr. 2f and a .735RB. the best accuracy came around 100gr. 2F. He's always used a substancial denim patch. At this time, in the .77,he's using a .030" patch which gives .0125" compression of the ball on each side. It loads very easily, by the way. A short starter is necesssary, of course.

 

[musketman]

I feel a longer barrel will be more accurate in a smoothbore due to it's longer sight plane...

A shorter barrel (30 inches) should be able to produce ample accuracy out to 60 yards, working up different loads will show which one is the better choice at the 60 yard range...

 

With that in mind, a rifle with a 30" barrel actually has a shorter sight radius than does a musket with a groove at the tang screw, as many had. My 14 bore rifle had a 30" barrel was dependable for 1 1/2" groups at 100yds. off the bags. O'Course, it had the best sights available, for a hunting rifle.
: Oops, the silver centering lines need polishing. the first two blads, the standing and 1st hinged, both have shallow "V" grooves, for fast, accurate sighting with the 1/16" silver headed front bead.

 

[Rat]

WOW. Now THAT'S a rear sight.

:master:

Rat

 

[rabjr]

Ooooh I want one of those! Dunno why but I do.

Ok, so, I wouldn't really gain much if I was to say, stretch the barrel out to 34" or maybe 36"? Nobody really sees a major differance from a 30" to a 36" that would warrent the extra length? Cool, short and light, I like it!

 

[B.Habermehl]

I have a 28 ga, with a 42 in barrel, and a 16 ga with a 28 inch barrel both flintlocks. I have won matches with both guns, one a combined woods walk against the rifle shooters, one a smooth bore only. So my opinion is that barrel length makes less difference than load development :results: For hunting I would still keep my shots inside of 50 yds for my own piece of mind. Both guns are capable of stretching out a bit further, but my comfort zone is still around 50 yds or less regardless.

 

[Rusty Old Gunns]

Rat had the best answer to your question. Your first load should be a tight ball and patch. Play with powder volumns until you get the ball to strike "point of aim" at about 50 yards.

An important trick to remember is for your subsequent rounds. (Incase you need a follow up shot) Use the same amount of powder and the same size ball. But ease off on your patch size.

You should be able to load your second round with a patch thin enough to allow you to seat the ball well below the muzzle with simple thumb preasure. It will seat quickly and ram home without a starter rod. Once the powder's down and the ball and patch pressed into the muzzle, you can even do the rest on the run.

I have a friend who has preloaded tubes with powder, wonder wad, ball and another wonder wad. You will still be in 8" at 50 yards with your follow up shot.

There's nothing worse than standing there loading as your wounded dinner makes it's way to the local MASH Unit.

Happy shooting.

 

[Rat]

Funny you should mention it.

For hunting, I load my first load into the clean barrel with a thick patch. Then around my neck I carry a 2-ball loading block, and they are both seated in thin patches, for exactly that reason. The thin patch in the fouled barrel loads the same as the thick patch in the clean barrel. I think my follow up shots load tighter than what you are talking about, but nothing like trying to get the really tight ball/patch combo down a fouled barrel.

Actually the block has three holes, and I keep two wonder wads in that one. I carry my main charges in paper cartridges. Just rip-n-pour.

My first shot from the cold, clean barrel always hits right on the mark too.

Rat