Bowie Knife Design Questions

[44-henry]

Hello,
I know there are some folks here that have some experience crafting this style knife. I would like to build one of these knives similar to the one presented to Thomas Alibone by than Secretary of State Henry Clay in 1848. Some pictures of this rather large and impressive knife are available if you Google "Henry Clay Bowie Knife" which will take you to the IMA site.

I have used the photographs from this site, and a few others to draw the blade in AutoCAD and I think the profile is pretty decent and accurate to the dimensions given at the above site, but I really don't have a top view or section cuts at this point to show the shape of the blade. Some sites have suggested that this blade was anywhere from 3/8" to 1/4" thick at the spine near the guard, but I do not know which would be most likely correct. Also, would the blade be uniform in thickness at the spine all the way to the start of the clip point (where the taper would begin), or would it be tapered all the way from the guard to the tip.

I am also curious about any construction details of the cross guard, whether it would have been one solid German silver casting, or was made in different sections.

Any thoughts on this would be appreciated.

Regards,

Alex Johnson

 

[Rifleman1776]

You have realy-really :stir: :stir: :shocked2:

But, do a search here, this subject has been much cussed and discussed.
A site that might be helpful: Arkansas, where it all started. http://www.historicarkansas.org/knife_gallery/

 

[LaBonte]

While I can't say exactly re: this particular Bowie, but on many, many original Bowies I've examined (over 500) the guard is one piece of solid GS plate (looks to be about 3/32"-1/8" thick?), with generally a hollow formed ferrule (20-24 gauge is typical on originals) just behind it, and the butt cap would be made in the same way - the hollow was often "filled" either with part of the handle (i.e. the ferrule and butt cap were fitted over the handle) or cutler's resin was used to fill them - a typical mix for cutler's resin was rosin, beeswax, and a filler such as brick dust or ground charcoal.
German Silver was typical for this era, but search for some GS with at least 20% nickel in it which is much closer to the period GS than the current most common GS with only 15-17% nickel.

While a few originals were over 1/4" thick again most of the originals I've examined were no thicker than 3/16" max at the guard (even the 9-12" blades)and were usually distal tapered from guard to point.

 

[LRB]

LaBonte is steering you true. Even the big Musso Bowie with it's massive blade is only 7/32" at the guard, then tapers to 3/16", weighing in at 1lb 12oz.

 

[crockett]

Both LaBonte and Wick are far more knowledgeable than I but I'll add my experience. I've only seen a couple of originals and the 3/16 to NO MORE than 1/4" seems correct. The other thing is taper, some modern Bowie knives have an even thickness from spine to about half way to the edge and then taper like a chisel to the edge. The few originals I've seen had flat tapers from spine to edge. Not concave or convex but flat.
That "White Brass" or nickel type fittings, they seem the more common than yellow type brass.
As far as "two piece", I'm not sure what you are referring to but sometimes the guard and ferrule might look like it is all one piece when in fact there is a flat guard and right behind it a ferrule.
Sometimes (not always) you can telephone the curator and they might take a few more photos and email them to you if you explain what you are trying to do. It's not that big a request with today's digital type cameras. Good luck. Yours is a noble pursuit.

 

[LaBonte]

While most Bowies did have the thinner blades there are a few - very few - Bowies with blades up to 3/8" wide - one is picture in the book, the Peacemakers by R. L. Wilson.

addendum: if you want to match the steel of the period as close as possible using modern steels I recommend 1065-1084 and heat treated to around 54RC or a bit less - most period knives are not near as hard as many modern makers (most originals are file sharp enable which today is about 58RC at max (most modern files are in the 59-62RC range).
FWIW - This is based on having a couple of dozen plues period knives tested both for hardness as well as chemical content of the steel...

 

[44-henry]

Thank you for all the information, that will be helpful. That was interesting about the heat treatment used. Looking at the Clay knife featured on the site you can see some fairly deep nicks in the cutting edge which are kind of interesting. It would seem that it was fairly soft for this to have occurred.

I'm not sure what steel I would use for this yet, about the only thing I have right now that would be big enough to make this knife with would be 01. I have been experimenting with some blister steel lately and suppose I could try and refine some of that to shear steel, I suppose that would be more authentic.

LaBonte, can you recall ever seeing an original that has a tapered tang, or were they constant thickness? Also, do you recall how deep the decorative etching on the blade typically was?

Thanks again for all the replies.

Regards,

Alex Johnson