Cap popped, rifle didn't fire, until later

[Crow-Feather]

At a Rondy in Wyoming, while at the range in competition, a rifle didn't fire after numerous attempts. The range master told the shooter to pace his rifle in front of the firing line on the ground. Being concerned with laying his rifle on the grass, the shooter placed the rifle in a beaded leather padded rifle case facing the targets. I have seen before where shooters think "darn, no powder" and immediately bring it behind the shooting line to clear the ball. I learned a valuable lesson that day as about 5 minutes later that rifle fired tearing the biggest hole in the shooter's rifle case. I actually learned three lessons. One, If it don't go off, believe there is powder in the rifle and treat it accordingly. Two, buy a CO2 ball remover, with the flintlock attachment. And three, if the ball is not removed, keep the bore pointed skyward and do not put the rifle in your vehicle until you have filled the barrel with water both down the bore and into the vent or drum. It pays to have a safety conscious rangemaster who is very knowledgeable about BP firearms as they had at that Rondy.

 

[hawkeye2]

All very good points. I learned or was taught in my early teens not to take the gun from the shoulder for at least 30 or more seconds if it did not go off immediately.

 

[IL Rifle]

And if you take it from your shoulder, point it downrange for about 5-10 minutes. I believe I first read that in the Dixie Gun Works "Book" in the late 70s.

 

[lyman54]

Wondering how that could happen after 5 min. I'm not doubting Crow-Feather at all, just curious.

 

[Carbon 6]

Wondering how that could happen after 5 min. I'm not doubting Crow-Feather at all, just curious.

Easy, most likely the gun wasn't cleaned properly before loading. patch remnants, oil soaked powder, a bug nest, all can prevent immediate ignition and slowly smolder away until finally "BOOM"
A liberal cleaning with alcohol before loading is a good idea.

 

[TGJaeger]

That story will give a guy a case of the clenches. Especially when you think about him casing it. I have never had a hangfire that was more than about a second or so. My brother had one that didnt fire until he’d lowered the shotgun from his shoulder.

 

[Crow-Feather]

Wondering how that could happen after 5 min. I'm not doubting Crow-Feather at all, just curious.

It was long enough that he tried several caps, then waited for the rangemaster to come up and discuss the problem, then to get his rifle case, walk to the firing line and place the rifle on the ground then the rifle set there for at least 1 to 2 minutes. I did not check my watch, but enough time went by that it scared the whatever outta us standing at the firing line. I believe that there was an ember in wet powder until it finally burned into dry powder.

 

[Eterry]

Wondering how that could happen after 5 min. I'm not doubting Crow-Feather at all, just curious.

Ask any firefighter or LEO. I've seen structures doused with 1000s of gallons of water and several HOURS later have a rekindle. That is very common.
Also responded to a grease fire in a kitchen that got into a vent. It was put out, but 24 hours later rekindled and the complex burned down.

Is Two Feathers' incident rare...absolutely. Unprecedented, no.

 

[nkbj]

Fouled powder can become a slow fuse.
Popping several caps might've supplied enough heat to dry a localized area enough to form a coal and get it going.

 

[bang]

If it seems impossible believe it can happen.

 

[Lippy984]

I recently was cleaning up a TC renegade that I last shot near 10years ago hunting. Well I left the damn thing loaded and neglected it. I sprayed WD40 down the barrel and let it sit...eventually pulled the ball out. Soaked it in the bathtub for 10+ min. I pulled the patch and tried getting most of the gooped up powder out, and figured I would try blasting the rest out with a cap aiming it at the ground. With the second cap, the rest of the powder came out like napalm...I thought that goo was going to burn a hole through the driveway. Haha

 

[Sinner]

Wow! 5 minutes later?...

 

[Sinner]

Ask any firefighter or LEO. I've seen structures doused with 1000s of gallons of water and several HOURS later have a rekindle. That is very common.
Also responded to a grease fire in a kitchen that got into a vent. It was put out, but 24 hours later rekindled and the complex burned down.

Is Two Feathers' incident rare...absolutely. Unprecedented, no.

Uhhh, a structure fire is nothing like a muzzleloader though... that's why no fire is out unless it's COLD and out.

 

[fire bear]

Slightly off topic I know but Eterry and Sinner reminded me of a swamp fire I worked on a few years ago that had a hurricane pass over it that dumped 9 inches of rain on it. We were still fighting that fire 5 or 6 days later when we were replaced by another management team. An interesting memory but I never thought a muzzle loader hang fire would bring it up.

 

[lyman54]

Thank you guys. I've learned something new today. Glad no one was hurt in these incidents.

 

[Sinner]

Keep em clean and pointed down range!

 

[Smokey Plainsman]

So many people neglect a proper cleaning. Almost certainly what happened, probably a neglected cone or vent.

 

[Eterry]

Uhhh, a structure fire is nothing like a muzzleloader though... that's why no fire is out unless it's COLD and out.

My point was...a smoldering ember is a smoldering ember, be it in a burnt down house or a 50 caliber muzzle loader barrel...
That's all.

 

[Rum River]

Was coaching 4-H Shooting Sports - a young man dryballed a rifle.
Load was supposed to be a .490 ball with 80 grs Pyrodex R/S.

We did the usual drill:
Called a hangfire, waited 60 seconds with it shouldered.
Recapped, repeated the 60 seconds.
Called a misfire, and I moved it to the designated bench pointed at the berm.
That's when the young man walked around the front of the bench.
I have to admit I lost my cool - no cursing but I was very "forceful" in my message.

Ten plus years roll by and I bump into the young man on main street.
Pumping my hand he told me had never forgotten that day on the muzzleloader line - and that after two Army hitches and deploying twice to the sandbox (the second time as a non-com) - he got it now.

 

[Sinner]

My point was...a smoldering ember is a smoldering ember, be it in a burnt down house or a 50 caliber muzzle loader barrel...
That's all.

You are quite right on that, but it's hard to believe such a small ember in such a small space would take so long to ignite. It's not hard to imagine a large fire of any sort taking days to die if it isn't cold and out.
It seems like there must have been quite a bit of fouling (moisture, oil?) to take so long to ignite. Very unusual, but certainly not out of the question.