CMC pistols history

[Sinner]

I'm hoping that someone more informed can tell me which company was called CMC, I'm assuming back in the 60's to 70's?
I picked up a New Orleans Ace and a Snake Eyes pistols. I know that classic firearms now sells the kits. I also know that at one time, Colt LLC had changed their name to CMC. I don't think that these are Colt guns.
Any help with some black powder history?

 

[hawkeye2]

"CMC Single Shot Replica Percussion .44 Caliber Pistol. This was made in the 1970s under license for the Colt Manufacturing Company. (They are marked “CMC”)" From a listing on Guns International.com. "CMC SINGLE SHOT REPLICA PERCUSSION PISTOL
4-1/2 in. barrel, made in the 1970s under license for the Colt Manufacturing Company marked “CMC/Pat. Pend., serial number 71128A, firing mechanism appears to work, possibly .44 cal" Brunk auctions.

I saw a couple of other listings that support CMC/Colt manufacture (under license). I had only known of them as Classic Arms from '77 or later. It seems CMC also made zinc diecast replica guns too in the late 60s in Japan. I remember the zinc revolvers but they sold for a little over $20 when for $10 more you could buy a firing Italian revolver.

 

[Zonie]

"CMC" stands for Colt's Manufacturing Company LLC, Hartford, CT.
It is the one and only Colt company originally known as "Colt's Patent Firearms Manufacturing Company".

Among the pistols they make/made, it is the company that machined, finished and assembled the Colt 2nd Generation Colt percussion revolvers between 1971 and 1978.
In 1978 they subcontracted production of the percussion revolvers to Iver Johnson Arms and Lou Imperato to finish the production between 1978 and 1982.
There was also a "Colt Blackpowder Arms Co." located in Brooklyn, NY., who made the 3rd Generation or, Signature series of colt percussion revolvers. This company was licensed to produce these Colt pistols and they are considered as authentic Colt's.

Colt never made a "New Orleans Ace" or "Snake Eye" pistol. These guns have always been made by Classic Arms, located in the USA.

 

[Sinner]

"CMC" stands for Colt's Manufacturing Company LLC, Hartford, CT.
It is the one and only Colt company originally known as "Colt's Patent Firearms Manufacturing Company".

Among the pistols they make/made, it is the company that machined, finished and assembled the Colt 2nd Generation Colt percussion revolvers between 1971 and 1978.
In 1978 they subcontracted production of the percussion revolvers to Iver Johnson Arms and Lou Imperato to finish the production between 1978 and 1982.
There was also a "Colt Blackpowder Arms Co." located in Brooklyn, NY., who made the 3rd Generation or, Signature series of colt percussion revolvers. This company was licensed to produce these Colt pistols and they are considered as authentic Colt's.

Colt never made a "New Orleans Ace" or "Snake Eye" pistol. These guns have always been made by Classic Arms, located in the USA.

Zonie, both of my pistols are marked CMC Pat. PEND.
Are these Classic Arms, marked with Colt Manufacturing Company?

 

[Oldbear63]

I'm hoping that someone more informed can tell me which company was called CMC, I'm assuming back in the 60's to 70's?
I picked up a New Orleans Ace and a Snake Eyes pistols. I know that classic firearms now sells the kits. I also know that at one time, Colt LLC had changed their name to CMC. I don't think that these are Colt guns.
Any help with some black powder history?

I have two New Orleans Aces and still have the box for one of them. The box only says "Made in USA" and has no other manufacturing indications. I might be able to find the original instructions if the question is important enough.

I like them, they are fun to shoot!

 

[Zonie]

Zonie, both of my pistols are marked CMC Pat. PEND.
Are these Classic Arms, marked with Colt Manufacturing Company?

If they don't have a Colt stallion trademark stamped on them I doubt that the Colt's Manufacturing Company had anything to do with them.

At the risk of upsetting all of our Ace, Snakeyes, and Duckfoot pistol lovers, I can't imagine Colt's company getting within arms reach of these guns let alone putting their company's name on them, even if they were threatened with being clobbered with a big stick.
Of course, I've been wrong before.

 

[Coot]

But not very likely to be wrong this time!

 

[hawkeye2]

" I can't imagine Colt's company getting within arms reach of these guns let alone putting their company's name on them, even if they were threatened with being clobbered with a big stick."

I would agree but there does seem to be a connection though tenuous. I'm posting a photo here of a CMC replica peacemaker (hope you don't mind that it's a photo of a model cartridge gun) that shows the use of the Colt signature logo on a CMC made in Japan box. They did make a '51 Navy model but I can't find a photo now that I want one. Could it be that CMC (Colt Manufacturing Company) was a Japanese established company that licensed the Colt signature logo for use on their cap firing guns? A Japanese registered CMC could have made the pepperbox and other muzzleloaders with no further connection with Colt Firearms which would be quite legal. In the time frame we are looking at I don't remember Colt (in the USA) referring to themselves as Colt Manufacturing Co. or similar though I could be wrong.

 

[Robert an saa fan]

Zonie, both of my pistols are marked CMC Pat. PEND.
Are these Classic Arms, marked with Colt Manufacturing Company?

Agree with Zonie's above. Have been collecting Colt's since the early 1970's and have never heard of or seen anything to support the idea that the various cap and ball CMC pistols have anything to do with Colt. Colt did not make these type of pistols in the 1800's.

The Guns International . com auction hawkeye2 noted above and posted a picture of refers to a copy of the Colt SAA i.e. Single Action Army / Peacemaker.

Possibly the Japanese copy company is paying a license fee to use the Colt logo and perhaps Colt markings if the markings are on the pictured model hawkeye2 posted.

Colt's full name has had various changes over the years. For example, the instruction manual for a late 2nd Generation 2nd Model Dragoon states Colt Industries Operating Group. The manual listing authorized Colt repair service stations states Colt Firearms Division, Colt Industries.

 

[Sinner]

Hmmm, I don't know, but I can't imagine why a Japanese made gun would have a patent pending, or serial number on black powder guns. I Don't believe these are from Japan.

Could it be that CMC (Colt Manufacturing Company) was a Japanese established company that licensed the Colt signature logo for use on their cap firing guns? A Japanese registered CMC could have made the pepperbox and other muzzleloaders with no further connection with Colt Firearms which would be quite legal. In the time frame we are looking at I don't remember Colt (in the USA) referring to themselves as Colt Manufacturing Co. or similar though I could be wrong.

Colt did change their name from Colt patent firearms to Colt Manufacturing Company, LLC (CMC) at some time in the 1900's, though I'm not sure of the date. It wasn't a Japanese company.
I don't think these are Colt guns either, but never would have thought they were from Japan.I've found absolutely nothing in searching CMC, except the references to Colt Manufacturing Company, LLC.
Thanks for sharing the picture of the box marked Mfg CMC, Tokyo

 

[Zonie]

The box for the "Colt" revolver shown in that photo clearly states it is a "die cast and plastic model". I don't know if a Japanese company would have needed to get permission from Colt's but if they were wise, I'm sure they paid some money to Colt's for the right to use the trademark.

 

[Sinner]

The box for the "Colt" revolver shown in that photo clearly states it is a "die cast and plastic model". I don't know if a Japanese company would have needed to get permission from Colt's but if they were wise, I'm sure they paid some money to Colt's for the right to use the trademark.

Oh, I didn't catch that. So I guess I'm still confused as to the company that made these black powder pistols then. It doesn't seem that a Japanese company would have a patent pending either. Oh well, they are well made and fun to shoot! Maybe some US company had permission to use Colt's CMC marking?