curly maple not showing figure

[Chevythunderman]

I have a stock I'm finishing right now and in the sanding process it showed awesome curl all the way through out the stock. Now after the first coat of af the curl is not there anymore. I didn't do anything any different than normal. The af went on a different color than other stocks have but the same bottle produced the right color on another piece of wood. I shook up the bottle really good before I started and after I heated up the finish it blushed out to the same color as it normally does. It just didn't bring out the curl like normal. The blank was a grade 4 just like the others were and its only showing curl now over I'd say 30-40% of the stock.

Any help would be appreciative. I sanded down to 320 grit over the whole stock. Blew off the stock and wiped down with alchohol before I stained(let it dry thoroughly)

 

[Vaino]

Grade 4 out of how many grades? Sometimes the curl doesn't "come out". You might have to follow up w/ an alcohol stain{s}. Each piece of wood is different and each takes stains differently.....Fred

 

[garra]

There was a thread where a method to bring out the grain was discussed. Topic#297391)
Hope that link works. Zonie described a method using lye/water mix to do so. Not sure if it works on wood that has been already be treated with something.

 

[Spikebuck]

In her book Longrifle Construction Manual, Susanne Warren-Bicio recommends that after staining and before applying the final finish, one "hot rubs" BLO, over a couple of days,into the stock until it will not take anymore to enhance the grain characteristics. I've done this on two rifles, and the grain just popped out to what I think was the most possible. Both of these are Grade 4 Maple (as rated by ToTW anyway):

While hard to show in pictures, what I think enhanced was the visibility "down into" the wood at various angles. A "translucent" finish, so-to-speak. Anyway, I like what it does and will continue to use it.

As a side note, both of these were finished with Tru-Oil afterwards...multiple coats rubbed back to minimize the glossy shine.

 

[Chevythunderman]

This is grade 4 with 6 being exceptional. The curl was there when I was sanding and they didn't come out with the aquafortis. But I only did one coat. Zonie what is the lye method and will that help in this situation? I know you told me about this once before but I cant seem to find it back in my archives.

 

[Zonie]

Follow this link
http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/6642/post/6642/fromsearch/1/

Using lye water to highlight the contrast between the stripes should work nicely even though some AF has been applied.

The lye will bring out the woods natural tannin.

If any kind of oils have been applied the lye water will have mixed results.

Lye attacks oil and turns it into a soap but there is a limited amount of this the lye can do.

As with all staining, sanding sealers or fillers should not be applied before any kind of staining is done.

This includes using AF. If a sealing coat of anything is applied to the wood before the AF is applied, it cannot do "its thing".
It will just dry on the surface of the wood.

 

[Stophel]

Honestly, I've never understood this "bringing out the curl" business. The wood is curly, or it isn't. Aqua fortis colors the wood, but won't "bring out" anything if it's not there to begin with. (And it is best to stain with A.F. at least twice to ensure full coverage and full strength. I will usually stain several times, as I will often find little spots in the wood surface that have to be fixed. You can apply it so many times that the wood no longer wants to "wet" with the A.F.) When done staining, it can be neutralized with a lye solution (or baking soda, which won't eat your fingertips off, but it's not historical, I don't like it, and it makes a different color from lye. Lye will make the stock a more red-orange color), but other than a color change, I have never seen any difference in the appearance of the curl. :idunno:

If you finish the stock by filling the grain with shellac/seedlac/buttonlac/somekindoflac, it will keep the wood lighter in color, clear and bright, and with an oil varnish on as a top coat, the wood will have depth and clarity and the curl will shift and change as you move the stock around in the light. This was a standard 18th-19th century finishing practice. If the grain is filled with oil, the stock will be much darker/redder, and some of the visual "depth" will be diminished, but it will still have a warm, natural look. Using pigment stains or aniline dyes fill the end grain with pigments, and while this may "bring out the curl" by making the exposed end grain darker, it's basically painting the wood, and depth and life and natural appearance are gone. And since I'm almost ranting anyway :grin: , there are many who will then take steel wool or sandpaper to "knock it down", basically taking down the high grain, leaving stripes of dark "valleys" and virtually unstained "peaks" of the curl... a deplorable practice that should be banned. :cursing:

I have always used "middle grade" curly maple stock blanks, or even plainer, and when properly finished, even the plainer stocks can show depth and life. :wink:

 

[Donny]

I have used walnut on several curly maple stocks to "bring out curl". ( I read that off the internet so it must be good) .
You could try it on your raw maple, first stain. I don't know how it would work on previously stained and varnished wood. :grin:

 

[Vaino]

Pictured below is a slab sawn grade #7 from Dunlap and 2 Dangler stains were used....w/ a complete dry between coats and nothing else was used. First stain was a dark brown and the 2nd stain was a reddidh brown. A light rub down w/ paper toweling that was slightly wetted w/ alcohol was all that was done .

Normally I use slab sawn blanks that are graded #4 or #5 and really prefer less curl so it's not the "high light" of the build. The bottom pic shows a #4 from Dunlaps and the same 2 stains were used along w/ the alcohol rub.....Fred

 

[Gustavo Hoefs]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IWCptCxNx4I

 

[Col. Batguano]

Does anyone know what is actually happening (chemically) with the AF when it's heated?

With dyes the color is fully dissolved in the carrier. With stains the pigment "chips" are carried, and the little flecks form a coating when the carrier evaporates, and more of them come to rest in open pores of wood (the curl) than on the closed portion.