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Do deer jump the flint Pan?
- Thread starter Tajue17
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Guest
Ted, I'm gonna say no. I've never aimed low on any game animal with a flintlock and my suggestion would be that you don't either.
Vic
Vic
Can't tell. I'm too busy jumping myself!
Unless it's a hang fire I do not believe they do, but then again they have incredible reflexes. A calm, unalarmed deer probably wouldn't. But an edgy deer looking at you might be wired enough to get some drop-in-preparation-for-a-spring going in that blink.
Amazing creatures.
Unless it's a hang fire I do not believe they do, but then again they have incredible reflexes. A calm, unalarmed deer probably wouldn't. But an edgy deer looking at you might be wired enough to get some drop-in-preparation-for-a-spring going in that blink.
Amazing creatures.
A well tuned flinter ought to be as fast as a percussion type fire. Now if your friends nicknamed you "Hangfire", aim low; otherwise forget it, that slug going to be in the deer's gizzard by the time you feel the gun snuggle into your shoulder.
It's not funny tg! Stumpkiller is right...it's the 'edgy' deer that are hard to hit.
I remember the first time I came up on a deer and he was standing (deer do this when they think no one is looking) by a scrape. He was smoking a cigarette (deer can do this because of the split hoof) and nervously looking around. His hoof was shaking and he was smoking way too fast. When I shot it was, like, in slow motion. Like in the Matrix. At the 'klatch' he spun around, leaned way to the right and arched his back. I could clearly see the ball pass by his shoulder. Then the patch hit the ground thowing up a shower of dirt and, like a flash, he was outta there!
Yes...I learned that day...don't never try to shoot a smoking deer.
Voyageur
I remember the first time I came up on a deer and he was standing (deer do this when they think no one is looking) by a scrape. He was smoking a cigarette (deer can do this because of the split hoof) and nervously looking around. His hoof was shaking and he was smoking way too fast. When I shot it was, like, in slow motion. Like in the Matrix. At the 'klatch' he spun around, leaned way to the right and arched his back. I could clearly see the ball pass by his shoulder. Then the patch hit the ground thowing up a shower of dirt and, like a flash, he was outta there!
Yes...I learned that day...don't never try to shoot a smoking deer.
Voyageur
Geeeeez......you know, it strikes me that all these responses could be making this individual feel very embarrassed...he may be new to flintlocks just like everyone is at some point, and it appears he asked a simple question in good faith because he didn't know...reading all these responses, it looks like "piling on"...
No flame intended, it was valid question, I don't think it would take anyone long to figure out the bunch here and not to get ruffled, everyone pretty much cuts up with everyone else, if newcommers can ride out the first wave the following ones will seem much milder...
When I was in the military, the first ship I was assigned to was typical. I was sent to the Bosun's locker for relative bearing grease and 40 foot of shoreline. I thought it was funny then and I still think it's funny.
I get more enjoyment out of laughing at myself than laughing at other folks. When I look at some of the things I've done in retrospect, they seem down right ludicrous.
For instance: One summer day my wife was working in the upstairs room of our daughter. She came to me and said there was a Waxwing that appeared to be hanging upside down in the top of the Lilacs that grow right off the side of the house. These Lilacs are about 20 feet tall. OK, so I got a ladder and braced it up against the Lilacs and crawled up to set the bird free. He (or she) had been collecting strands from an old plastic blue tarp for it's nest. Reaching out I freed the bird, the ladder slipped and there I was swinging from the top of the Lilacs scared out of my wits. Well with the help of my wife, I finally got back to terra firma. Later, I wondered why I just didn't just use the hedge clippers to cut the strand. But no, having donned my cape, I just had to free it myself.
I use that story to shrink my swollen ego when it gets out of hand. As you can imagine, Animal Rescue is not beating down my door to give lectures to the troops!
We certainly did not mean to embarass Ted...but the situation was ripe for ribbing and I would like to think that I don't have to be so overly sensitive that I have to second guess who might be offended by any particular post. In 60 years no one has ever accused me of being malicious and I certainly have never tried to be. Ted, if you see this, I aplogize. If you like I will never use humor in replying to a post of yours again...but you will miss some fine commaraderie and insights. If you were not offended then you are like the rest of us and will take your opportunities for ribbing us in return.
I get more enjoyment out of laughing at myself than laughing at other folks. When I look at some of the things I've done in retrospect, they seem down right ludicrous.
For instance: One summer day my wife was working in the upstairs room of our daughter. She came to me and said there was a Waxwing that appeared to be hanging upside down in the top of the Lilacs that grow right off the side of the house. These Lilacs are about 20 feet tall. OK, so I got a ladder and braced it up against the Lilacs and crawled up to set the bird free. He (or she) had been collecting strands from an old plastic blue tarp for it's nest. Reaching out I freed the bird, the ladder slipped and there I was swinging from the top of the Lilacs scared out of my wits. Well with the help of my wife, I finally got back to terra firma. Later, I wondered why I just didn't just use the hedge clippers to cut the strand. But no, having donned my cape, I just had to free it myself.
I use that story to shrink my swollen ego when it gets out of hand. As you can imagine, Animal Rescue is not beating down my door to give lectures to the troops!
We certainly did not mean to embarass Ted...but the situation was ripe for ribbing and I would like to think that I don't have to be so overly sensitive that I have to second guess who might be offended by any particular post. In 60 years no one has ever accused me of being malicious and I certainly have never tried to be. Ted, if you see this, I aplogize. If you like I will never use humor in replying to a post of yours again...but you will miss some fine commaraderie and insights. If you were not offended then you are like the rest of us and will take your opportunities for ribbing us in return.
Guest
Ted, your question is quite valid. The same question was asked on another forum and Gary Brumfield stated that he believes that any animal that can jump the string of a bow, can jump the flash. He stated that years ago, he had a turkey "duck" the flash and caused him to miss a head shot. In case you don't know, Gary was the gunsmith at Williamsburg for 20 years and quite likely knows more about things flintlock than the collective knowledge of this entire list. Not saying that the members of this list don't know anything. There is lots of experience and knowledge here, just that Gary is several cuts above us. Bottom line, the jury is still out on your question and I don't think it's a question to which a difinitive answer can be given. That being the case, we're seeing more in the way of clever answers. To those with the clever answers, keep em coming. Gotta love it!!
Respectfully
Cody
Respectfully
Cody
Guest
Ted, I'll pull some of the flame my way. If you swap your flinter for a inline with a 150g charge the deer won't jump soon enough.
T17,
There is a lot of difference between an arrow speed and and a roundball.
Also a bow will "twang" with vibration while a flintlock goes "poof".
If all works right, it goes "clickbang".
I have had several jump the string on an arrow, sometimes they were totally unaware but still dropped on instinct. I have never seen one fast enough to jump a well tuned, properly loaded flintlock.
You can see the flight of an arrow very well at most any distance, especially at 30 yards or so. After all they are only going 250 to 300 FPS, while the flintlock is going 5 or 6 times that fast.
If you hold low, you will hit low.
If you flinch or leave some oil in the bore, you will probably miss. Then you can say "the deer jumped the pan"
There is a lot of difference between an arrow speed and and a roundball.
Also a bow will "twang" with vibration while a flintlock goes "poof".
If all works right, it goes "clickbang".
I have had several jump the string on an arrow, sometimes they were totally unaware but still dropped on instinct. I have never seen one fast enough to jump a well tuned, properly loaded flintlock.
You can see the flight of an arrow very well at most any distance, especially at 30 yards or so. After all they are only going 250 to 300 FPS, while the flintlock is going 5 or 6 times that fast.
If you hold low, you will hit low.
If you flinch or leave some oil in the bore, you will probably miss. Then you can say "the deer jumped the pan"
quote:Originally posted by Cody Tetachuk:
Ted, your question is quite valid. The same question was asked on another forum and Gary Brumfield stated that he believes that any animal that can jump the string of a bow, can jump the flash.If you lead the deer a *TAD*, (like shooting ducks) you should be able to hit a running deer with ease...
*TAD*
Holding just a bit in front of the moving deer in hopes that the round ball and the deer will meet at a pre-set point, whereas by the time the deer gets to said pre-set point, the round ball will be a milisecond from entering into a vital area.
Ted, your question is quite valid. The same question was asked on another forum and Gary Brumfield stated that he believes that any animal that can jump the string of a bow, can jump the flash.If you lead the deer a *TAD*, (like shooting ducks) you should be able to hit a running deer with ease...
*TAD*
Holding just a bit in front of the moving deer in hopes that the round ball and the deer will meet at a pre-set point, whereas by the time the deer gets to said pre-set point, the round ball will be a milisecond from entering into a vital area.
thanks for the Jokes guys but that only proves your not as experienced as you think you "Might" be, and Im saying that with a smile. I made some calls and some people here seem to agree that yes deer sometimes do react to the Hammer hitting the frizzen or any noise made by anything at the time the trigger is pulled. if its quiet and you have a nervous deer (the deer that knows somethings not right) and he/she is in close it will react. I was told it may not beat the ball so to speak but it does instinctivley drop to spring-up at any sudden or sharp noise. I've hunted alot of deer and even though I have never opened a pan at a deer my experience tells me they have to drop at least a couple inches, did you really hit it where you had that sight? I'll play it safe and go low for now with the flintlock especially with these late season deer that pretty much had enough of being shot at. thanks though for all the posts, I still learn something everytime I Post here. Happy Holidays, Ted from Mass.
In the 1972 issue of the Gun Digest is an article dealing with the relative quickness of caplock vs. flintlock. Using a camera that operated at 7000 frames per second they determined from the start of the fall of the hammer (cock) to when flame first appeared at the muzzle of the rifle the following was true:
Caplock was: .022 of a second
Flintlock was: .055 of a second
The speed of sound at 60 F is approximately 1200 feet per second.
It takes approximately .75 of a second for an organism to hear, interpret and react to a sound unless the organism is expecting the sound and knows what is going to happen
Caplock was: .022 of a second
Flintlock was: .055 of a second
The speed of sound at 60 F is approximately 1200 feet per second.
It takes approximately .75 of a second for an organism to hear, interpret and react to a sound unless the organism is expecting the sound and knows what is going to happen
Geeze... by the time I get all that figured out the deer will be long gone.... I think I will continue to hold where I want the ball to hit, if the deer moves I suspect it will not be enough to change the poi enough to spoil the shot.
and I should of also mentioned maybe this divided line has something to do with slow fire pans and a well tuned one's so don't get me wrong you may be absolutely right. Im shooting a L&R queen anne lock which is pretty fast. but Im also shooting a smootbore and it don't matter where Im aiming cause the ball hits where it wants it seems but Im still trying new loads.
anyway, thanks again for the opinions. Ted
anyway, thanks again for the opinions. Ted
