Does agate "damage" a frizzen?

[Sentry44]

Guys I am NOT trying to start a fistfight. But...

I was talking to 'a guy' who definitely had more time than me in flintlocks (it's a super low bar, but still...) and he said agate beats up a frizzen, and I should stick with English flints in my Lyman GPR.

Is agate THAT hard? Cuz...just prior to his interjecting his 'wisdom' I was getting some damn fine shots off...

What sayeth the crowd?

Sentry44

 

[zimmerstutzen]

I have seen cut flints chew through the TC frizzens case hardeneing. It is more a factor of lock geometry. Does the agate edge arc down against the frizzen the way a flint should or does it just bash into it. TC's early locks were bashers. OTH, I had a Curly Gostomski built North Star trade gun which probably had the best lock geometry of any lock made and honestly, I used the same English flint for over a decade of shooting, smooth bore matches, hunting, etc. Always had super fast reliable ignition. I prefer English flints across the board for all guns. Look for a uniform translucent gray color, hold it up to the light to check for cracks and chips. If it is muddy looking, chipped or cracked, pass on that one and pick another. At half cock, the flint should be just a hair away from contacting the frizzen.

 

[TDM]

Guys I am NOT trying to start a fistfight. But...

I was talking to 'a guy' who definitely had more time than me in flintlocks (it's a super low bar, but still...) and he said agate beats up a frizzen, and I should stick with English flints in my Lyman GPR.

Is agate THAT hard? Cuz...just prior to his interjecting his 'wisdom' I was getting some damn fine shots off...

What sayeth the crowd?

Sentry44

Flint, Chert, and Agate are all microcrystalline Quartz. They all have a hardness measurement of 7 on the Mohs scale.

 

[Sentry44]

Interesting, and makes sense about how/where it strikes. I will have a careful look at the strike geometry.

Also interesting shared point on the hardness. If true, then the substance itself ALONE shouldnt be a problem. What you're suggesting is more strik angle than anything. Helpful.

Sentry44

 

[user 49399]

I’ve used agate for years with no problems. That’s just my experience.

 

[Sentry44]

I definitely value hearing that. What gun and lock do you have?

Sentry44

 

[user 49399]

I used them on a Miroku .69 smooth bore pistol, a Loyalist Arms .62 Fusil de Chasse and a Chambers .62 smooth rifle.

 

[Brokennock]

Interesting, and makes sense about how/where it strikes. I will have a careful look at the strike geometry.

Also interesting shared point on the hardness. If true, then the substance itself ALONE shouldnt be a problem. What you're suggesting is more strik angle than anything. Helpful.

Sentry44

The different shape and size of the cut agates, compared to hand knapped flint or chert, would be more to blame for any "damage" done. That size and shape could effect where and how the edge strikes the frizzen, similar to bevel up or bevel down.

 

[DuncNZ]

I used agate and Jasper cut flints on a Pedersoli Mortimer shotgun because they were the only ones I had that were the correct size , and got reliable ignition and no measurable frizzen wear for a number of years , I still have several in my flint boxes .

 

[sturmkatze]

When I was young, there were no no stores by me and I was bemoaning this to an old gun guy and he told me about chert. I could easily find it there in Central California and used it for years. Ate the frizzen on my tc renegade. I replaced it later. When you’re young and poor and it’s the 80’s, you use what ya got.

 

[zimmerstutzen]

I’ve used agate for years with no problems. That’s just my experience.

That's only half the story. in what locks?

 

[user 49399]

That's only half the story. in what locks?

See post #7.

Keep in mind that I shoot percussion (rifles and pistols) more than flintlock. I may not have shot flintlocks as much as others which might account for my lack of frizzen wear.

 

[Rifleman1776]

I have use cut/swan flints in my longrifle with a Pete Allen Siler lock for nearly a half century. These are German flint. Some are agate, some jasper, other unknown. Right fit and good geometry of lock are determining factors.

 

[DixieTexian]

Agate was knapped into points back in the day and even now, so I'm not sure why it would cause more wear than a flint. I'm gonna guess that cheaper locks with poor geometry are more likely to be used by folks who don't spend the extra time to find knapped flints and then end up with accelerated wear that then gets blamed on the sawn flints.

 

[TDM]

Good geometry is the key for both long flint life and long frizzen life.