Dropping lead into water

[TreeMan]

Oddest thing happened with my most recent casting session. I have a Parker hale musketoon, a Lyman wad cutter 575-494 mold, and a huge supply of old lead water line ive been using for balls and bullets. I’ve shot 100+ of these wad cutters out of the musketoon. A few days ago I wanted to shoot it some and realized I was out of bullets. I fired up the melting pot and made about 25. Since I was in a hurry to shoot I dropped the cast bullets into a pot of water to cool them quickly. I then lubed them and tried to do some shooting. Oddly the water cooled bullets wouldn’t fit the bore of the musketoon. It’s like the water cooling made them a tad bit larger. All the other ones I’ve made prior that air dried were a nice tight thumb push fit. Same lead, same mold, same casting temp. Did I cause a chemical reaction by hastening the cooling process that caused the lead to expand, or water cooling it keep it from constricting by air drying?

 

[11th corps]

Are you sure your mold blocks were closing completely during casting? I have had issues with Lee molds producing oversize balls. Water dropping normally just hardens the lead.

 

[Brokennock]

I would have thought the water might have shrunk them further, not enlarged them.
Warmer day than when the other bullets were cast?

 

[TreeMan]

Are you sure your mold blocks were closing completely during casting? I have had issues with Lee molds producing oversize balls. Water dropping normally just hardens the lead.

No the mold was working fine. Bullets look pretty as always without casting lines. I’m gonna make some more this week and let them air cool to see if it changes.

 

[TreeMan]

I would have thought the water might have shrunk them further, not enlarged them.
Warmer day than when the other bullets were cast?

Nothing drastically different that I can remember. I used the same lead, pot temp, and technique as usual. Has me baffled. They are so much oversized they actually need ran through a sizer. I got a few to load but had to tap them in with a hammer which was difficult as they wanted to cant to the side.

 

[bubba.50]

You 'tempered' the lead by dropping them in the water. it makes them a little bit harder.

 

[ZUG]

Dropping the bullets into water will not change the lead bullet IF your lead is PURE lead. The water bath will only effect an alloyed lead. I would measure the bullet after it's air cooled on your next casting session then drop some bullets fresh out of the mold into water. I would then measure those and compare the two. Make sure that you cast a large enough sample of both to get a fair representation of the two batches. My two cents worth

 

[mooman76]

I've never noticed any difference in size between water dropped and air cooled but then again I never bothered to measure either.

 

[ord sgt]

I always push every minie that I cast through a sizing die. My Lee mold is .575, 500 grain. I have a sizing die in .575 and I see marks on the lube rings from the sizing die. I get consistent size minies this way. No variables.

 

[ohio ramrod]

I also run my mini's through a sizing die to get consistency.

 

[Flinty Scot]

i wonder if dropping the hot balls into water could have deformed them, very slightly but enough to bind on loading?

 

[sportster73hp]

Unless you were shooting as you were casting the lead should cool in 5 minutes or so. What’s the hurry? I will admit to dropping unmentionable projectiles into water

 

[TreeMan]

Unless you were shooting as you were casting the lead should cool in 5 minutes or so. What’s the hurry? I will admit to dropping unmentionable projectiles into water

They are gonna go back in the pot. No more water cooling.

 

[Blitz]

They are gonna go back in the pot. No more water cooling.

let us know the dimensions, water dropped and air cooled
My thought is they are same size but water dropped is of course harder and more difficult to load.

Buzz

 

[nhmoose]

I drop my 9mm bullets into water but it has nothing to do with ML.

 

[TDM]

Or a 2 year old thread either…..

 

[nhmoose]

Until the software allowing the threads to get renewed DILLAGAFF. PO

 

[Notchy Bob]

I didn't think pure lead would harden, regardless of how it was heated or cooled. I thought the only way to harden it would be to alloy it with a slightly harder metal.

I would agree with @ZUG . Maybe set up your casting equipment, get everything up to running temperature and cast a few bullets to air cool and also cast a few to drop in water. Same mould, same lead, same session. Let them all sit long enough to equalize to the ambient temperature, possibly 24 hours, and then measure them.

This could be interesting.

Best regards,

Notchy Bob

 

[Dude]

TreeMan - did you ever figure out what the deal was?

 

[DixieTexian]

What probably happened is that the water was cold enough that it caused them to cool too quickly from the outside in. As it cooled at a quicker rate, the lead on the outside contracted, sucking in the lead on the inside, which pulled a vacuum and made a void on the inside of the bullets. Of course, given the normal volume of lead, but with a void in the center, it takes up more space and you end up with a larger diameter than if you had allowed it to cool more slowly. I bet if you sawed some of them in half you would be able to see the void.

I make (or more accurately chemically modify) plastic for a living, and out extruder runs strands of plastic through a chilled water bath to cool them off before running them through a cutter that then pelletizes the strands. With plastics that swell a lot when molten, the strands look almost like straws because the outside has cooled so quickly that they created enough vacuum while shrinking in the chilled water bath that they pulled a void in the center.