English Muzzleloading Shotguns

[Xringshooter]

A customer brought these to me for identification and valuation as she wants to sell them. I honestly looked for info but just couldn't come up with much. Could they be fired if cleaned up good?

Manton 10ga percussion 39" barrel, the front ramrod holder has broken loose but is with the shotgun, barrels appear to be Damascus, could not see any proof marks but haven't taken the barrels off the stock :

Ketland Adams ?? 16ga flintlock 36" barrel

It was recommended to me to come here, I was told this is probably the best muzzleloading forum.\

Thanks for any help that may be provided. I do have a few more pictures (the ramrods, and such).

Ron

 

[Feltwad]

The Manton which is a late one most likely by Manton & Co with its double wedge and 39 inch Barrels is more than Likely to be a double 8 bore or 6 bore images of the proof marks will help . If it is a 10 bore then it is unusual to have a barrel length of 39 inch and a double wedge unless specially built for some one
Feltwad

 

[Xringshooter]

I stated 10 bore because that is what my quick bore gauage said. That said, at the 10 ga marking it was a llttle bit loose in the bore (maybe a 1/32 on each side of the gauage). The exact measurement of both bores, at the muzzle, is 20.1 mm

 

[Brokennock]

A customer brought these to me for identification and valuation as she wants to sell them. I honestly looked for info but just couldn't come up with much. Could they be fired if cleaned up good?

Manton 10ga percussion 39" barrel, the front ramrod holder has broken loose but is with the shotgun, barrels appear to be Damascus, could not see any proof marks but haven't taken the barrels off the stock :

Ketland Adams ?? 16ga flintlock 36" barrel

It was recommended to me to come here, I was told this is probably the best muzzleloading forum.\

Thanks for any help that may be provided. I do have a few more pictures (the ramrods, and such).

Ron

Do you have any full length pics of both guns? I do really like that flintlock 16 gauge.

 

[Xringshooter]

Here's one (not so good) of the flintlock, I'll try to get some more of it and the double barrel and post them.

 

[Brokennock]

Here's one (not so good) of the flintlock, I'll try to get some more of it and the double barrel and post them.

Thanks. Would love to know more about it. Both are really great guns.

 

[Feltwad]

For what I can see from the image the gun by Ketland is an early one it is minus the leg from the pan to the frizzen which was common on the early flintlocks also the barrel is foreign with no breech only the plug and tang in the rear and is stamped on the barrel side flats which could be Ketland own proof which is similar to the later Birmingham Proof . It would be interesting to see the internals of the lock has most of these locks were minus the bridle.
Feltwad
A similar lock

 

[dave_person]

Hi,
Ketland and Adams existed for 2 years 1820-1822 in Birmingham. According to Brian Godwin, Joe Puleo, and others there was no Ketland proof mark or proof house. The marks identified as such are almost always private Tower marks. The marks on the Ketland gun look like Birmingham marks for after 1813. Here is a link to Research Press in the UK where you can download Godwin's paper on the cross scepter marks.
http://www.researchpress.co.uk/index.php/publishing/downloads/category/3-barrel-markings
dave

 

[Capt. Jas.]

Hi,
Ketland and Adams existed for 2 years 1820-1822 in Birmingham. According to Brian Godwin, Joe Puleo, and others there was no Ketland proof mark or proof house. The marks identified as such are almost always private Tower marks. The marks on the Ketland gun look like Birmingham marks for after 1813. Here is a link to Research Press in the UK where you can download Godwin's paper on the cross scepter marks.
http://www.researchpress.co.uk/index.php/publishing/downloads/category/3-barrel-markings
dave

Concur 100%