FIE KY .45 cal M/L Rifle

[cork27]

I just received a New in the Box, .45 cal KY M/L of Italian mfg. imported by the long defunked FIE corporation, after cleaning the bore, replacing the nipple, and inspection it appears to be ready to shoot. This rifle is of the welded breech design, 33" long 7/8 hex barrel. My problem is there was not a manual with the gun nor can I find one. Does any one have one or know what the maximum charge for theis rifle is?

 

[bingo1952]

I wouldn't shoot any gun with a welded breech. If you are able to return it for your money I urge you to do so. JMO

 

[cowpoke1955]

Have a gunsmith look at it. If it is welded, do as runnball sugested. If it is not, look up the specs on the old .45 CVA Kentucky. They should be about the same.

 

[cork27]

The rifle was not repaired it was made that way by the manufacturer and proofed. So I ask why your concern if I use less than 90 grain Pyrodex RS load and a .440 patched ball? Forgive me, I am new to muzzleloading and have a lot to learn but a long time shooter/instructor and ex-EOD.

 

[bingo1952]

The grain structure of a weld is more like a casting than a weld. If the weld lets go you will get a face full of metal. These old guns for the most part were not very good when FIE was in business and any proof mark on one of them imported by FIE from that era would also be suspect in my mind.

 

[cork27]

Thank you. I will sand bag and string up the trigger on the sucker, load it up to 120 grs. with a 200 gr. mini and proof test it a couple of times and see what happens as I am pretty sure I can not return it.

 

[zimmerstutzen]

I've seen several FIE's over the years One or two had tangs welded to the breech, but they all had breech plugs screwed into the barrels. A great many guns had bolsters welded to the barrels, and no one ever complains about them being suspect.

Now given that it is a 45 cal and a lesser quality gun as things go, I would NEVER consider a load even as hot as 90 grains. 50 to 70 sure. Never 90. for a 45 cal 32 inch barrel, according to Lyman's Black Powder Handbook, the point of diminishing returns is an 80 grain load. Anything over that wastes powder as muzzle flash and creates excessive fouling.

 

[hanshi]

You might want to show it to a gunsmith or a knowledgeable bp shooter and see what they advise. My question is; are you sure it's welded? The only way I'd trust it is if the breech plug is at least threaded into the barrel. If it's screwed into the barrel and THEN welded that's a different story.

 

[paulvallandigham]

"Proofing" the gun yourself may not assure you of anything, and may actually damage the gun so that it blows up in your face faster, using normal loads. I do NOT RECOMMEND you "Proof" the barrel.

If that weld is suspect, putting high pressure loads in the barrel will just accelerate the stress on the welds.

These were junk guns- wall hangers-- back when they were sold. No one seriously used them for shooters. And if they were fired, they were shot ONLY with PRB and powder charges that would not exceed 60 grains of FFFg GOEX BLACK POWDER.

You are proposing loads with higher pressure, hotter burning substitute powders. DO NOT USE THEM. Reduce the substitute powders by 15% by volume, to be safe with them. That would mean a maximum charge of 50 grains of a substitute, to be equal to the 60 grain charge of Goex FFFg powder.

Send it back, and get your money back. You can find much better firearms, even used, for the same money, or for not much more. Safety is ALWAYS an issue with Black Powder guns, and I believe you understand that. What you need to understand that these cheap guns do give way, and have. They don't get stronger with age! :shocked2: :hmm: :thumbsup:

 

[rafterob]

I know nothing about that particular gun but in my Italian made Euroarms,.45 cal,36inch barrel I use 50 grains FFFg and that load is plenty good out to 100 yards. Someone will eventually reply that has some actual experience with that make.

 

[hanshi]

I tend to agree with Paul. How ever you decide to approach this, proofing it yourself is a no, no. :shake: :shake: :shake:

 

[ohio ramrod]

WARNING WARNING while over loading a few times seems like a good proofing method. There is such a thing as "metal fatigue" . Simply stated the barrel/breech could hold up under test, but still be weakened and fail latter. Just think about truck leaf springs that last for years on heavy loads then break one day on a small bumb and no load.

 

[Zonie]

I agree. Do not "proof" the gun by overloading it. Especially in a .45 caliber gun.

Small bores like a .45 and under develop very high breech pressures very rapidly as the powder load increases.

If the "weld" turns out to be used to connect the tang to a screwed in breech plug then it should not be of concern.

If the breech plug was inserted into the rear of the barrel and then a circumferential weld was made around the joint it should be suspect and probably used as a decoration.

If the breech is sound then powder loads of 45-50 grains under a patched .440 diameter roundball would be a good load for it.

 

[ncswift]

is the .45 CVA Kentucky a decent rifle?

 

[bingo1952]

Not the best quality but usually very servicable. Most will break a clay pigeon offhand at 50 yards assumng the shooter does his/her part.

 

[ncswift]

Thank you.