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mrbortlein

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For those who make their own knife blades out of old files; what is the best method for doing this?
I recently picked up 5-6 old files that belonged to my father-in-law's grandfather and I wanted to re-gift one to him for Christmas.
Thanks,
mrbortlein
 
Marcus, I have only done one knife from a file, so there may well be better methods than what I used. I heated the file to bright red and let it set in a large can of wood ash overnight. Then I proceeded to take everything off that didn't look like a knife by the stock reduction method (grinding!). When shaping was finished, I reheated the blade and quenched it in light motor oil, then tempered it.
 
I've made knives from files by either stock removal (already described) or forging. I by far prefer the forging method....
 
I too prefer forging, stock removal just takes the fun out of it. An advantage to forging is you are not limited by the size of the file with stock removal what you have at first limits your finished product. in forging you can bend it bend it back, cut it put it back together make it fat and make it skinny way more fun right? :grin:
 
Forging is the best way.....if you have a forge!..

Nothing wrong with stock removal method for a person who doesn't have a forge and has only one knife project in mind, or even a couple!

JMHO
Rick :wink:
 
There's nothing wrong with stock removal i have a few knives I've made this way. If he doesn't have a forge a hole in the ground and a hair dryer served me well for a while. My favorite knife that i made was made in a coffee can with a hole in it and a hair dryer stuck next to it.
 
HAIRDRYER :shocked2: !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!, not knocking you here but how in the heck does a hair dryer get hot enough to forge with???????????? they don't get hot enough to heat horns for sizing, please explain this one to me , thanks!
 
I think he is using the hairdryer as a blower to force air into the coals so they burn hotter. I have thought about using a leaf blower if I were ever to do that, but I don't see me having the time for the next 25 years....................watch yer top knot..............
 
Buford, You are correct. He is just using it for the air blast to heat the coals.
A leaf blower would be way too much, A hair dryer needs to be used on the lower settings to keep from waisting the coal. It does not take much. :v
 
Stock removal on a file blade has one good advantage. The grain structure and grain size is at just about as good as it will ever be, unless the file is over heated. If, in a darkened area, you raise the heat on the file until you begin to see a low red color, and try to hold that level of color for a minute or so, the carbon will form into balls in the steel. This allows cutting tools to slide past these balls. I would say, repeat this a few times, and the file should be soft enough to work with, without a common annealling process, which does not do well on steels of high carbon content. If a common anneal is used, the carbon forms layers which will resist drill bits, and other cutting tools. The process is known as spheroidizing annealling. Then shape into what you want by grinding or filing. When ready to heat treat, bring the heat to a red-orange, hold at that color for a minute, or a few minutes if possible, and quench in warmed canola oil. File steel requires a fast cooling quench, and canola is the fastest other than commercial quench oil. At this point, a good file should not even scratch it in the least. Then temper at 450°, twice, for one hour each time. Just use your kitchen range, governed by a separate oven thermometer. When you file check for hardness after the quench, you will have a few thousandths of decarb on the surface, burned away by the heating. Be sure and file check deep enough to get below the decarb.
 
Beav,............ :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

You mean your forging your horns too!... So that's how you get 'um so flat..your melting them! :youcrazy:

Rick ......... :haha:
 
One point, you need a big file. A lot of files- by the time you grind off the teeth you end up with a much smaller blade than you may want. I've done a few- boot knives, etc. From I understand the file has to be old, the newer ones don't have as good steel.
 
New file steel is as good as old file steel, depending on the chosen steel used, and method of manufacture. Obviously you don't want a case-hardened file. Nicholson and Simmons are two of the best, and as good or better than old ones. Nicholson apparently uses a special mix 1095 type steel, with a tad of extra carbon, and possibly a touch of vanadium. Test reports I have read, show them to be a bit over 1% carbon, and all you have to do is break a piece off to see the super fine grain size.
 
Thanks for all of the info. I don't have a forge. I don't have the time to do the work either. What do you think it would cost to have it done?
mrbortlein
 
My method is quite simple first build a good fire in the shop stove, When the fire has a good bed of red hot coals I lay the files on the coals add a few more fine pieces of wood and then let the fire burn out over night. This anneals the file. You can then shape your blade either by forging or cutting/grinding. When you are ready to harden the finished blade heat it until a magnet doesn't attract it (critical temp) quench in oil ( hold it by tongs verticle do not "throw it in the oil") then after it cools reheat in an oven to five hundred degrees (Best done when SWMBO is not around).Repeat oven tempering, This will temper the blade. :idunno: :idunno:
 
With all due respect, a little too simple for a hypereutectic steel. You might get away with that using the hypoeutectic 10XX steels, but not those above .77 carbon. Non-magnetic is not critical heat, nor a good heat for quenching any steel. Critical heat is your target heat for austentizing and quenching a particular type of steel, and is at mimimum 50°/60° hotter than non-magnetic, which remains a constant 1414°.
 
I've made two out of files. The first was "ok", but the second was exquisite. Made it for my daughter, and it was the best knife in the family. Sadly, it was stolen a couple of months ago. My daughter was crushed :( .

One thing I learned when heat treating is to keep the blade a little thicker than the finished shape, quench and aneal back slightly, then grind to final shape. If you heat with a fine edge, the edge will heat up faster, and cool faster, than the thicker material. You might end up with a brittle, or damaged edge. When doing the final grinding, constantly keep the metal cool by dipping in water, so you don't loose the temper. Hope this helps. Bill.
 
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