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tjohnson56

40 Cal.
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Mar 1, 2008
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I'm going the range soon and plan plan on giving filler a try. I'll start with a load of 80 grn. 2f with 40 grn of corn meal under a PRB. does this sound about right in a .54? Anybody use corn meal in the past that can give me an idea of how much is too much or to little.
 
Fillers are not an exact science. You want enough filler to provide a seal when the filler is compacted. 40 grains in a .54 is about right, I think. I use 20 grains in my .50( This is always measured by volume, not by actual weight!) You might be able to use less, but if you have a 40 grain( by volume ) tube, to throw the corn meal, use it.

Understand that the meal will be compressed substantial when the gun fires. BUT, it either burns up, or is scattered in the air in front of the muzzle. ( Both, actually, occur.) If you are shooting into the wind, you may find corn meal coming back into your face, along with the smoke from your shot. Shooting a BP gun into the wind is never pleasant, so be conscious of the wind direction before you fire a load with a filler, too.
 
I wear glasses so no problem with blow back in the face.

I want to keep things safe so i'm more concerned with if I can put to much corn meal in than not enough. Seems like to much corn meal would give the burning powder to much time to compress the corn meal and build to a high pressure before moving the ball.

Anybody got an idea what the upper limit on corn meal would be with 80 grn 2f and a PRB.
 
Mix with some lard and you can collect the corn meal sloosh all hot and ready to eat about ten or fifteen yards out.
 
Don't worry about excess pressure building up. As long as you throw consistent volume measures of filler you will get the same accuracy. Its the weight of the RB, and the friction of that ball against the wall of the bore of the gun that creates the Inertia, and causes the build-up of pressure. The filler add very little actual mass( weight). To find out how much, go ahead an put a volume of your filler on a powder scale and weigh it. It will vary some with the relative humidity, but not very much. 40 grains by volume of corn meal will have trouble pushing 20 grains by weight. Considering the weight of a ball will be 175 grains for a .50, or 230 grains for a .54, that does not add any significant weight to the mass being pushed out the barrel.

I suppose if you loaded the rest of the barrel to the muzzle with filler, and then put a PRB into the muzzle, you won't get any accuracy, and you will get more pressure, but I suspect not enough to make up for the difference in seating the ball down the barrel properly.
 
Have you considered felt wads? they are easier to deal with and cheap to make yourself.
All you need is the felt, lube, and a punch.
For example I just got a sheet of 1/8 inch felt from duro-felt that is 12x54 inches. That is roughly 2500 .50 cal wads by my math for $14 plus a punch which cost me about $6.
So for $20 plus the cost of my homemade lube which is just a couple bucks I have enough wads for a ton of shooting.
Well worth the effort IMO and I don't mess with other fillers.

HD
 
I've got to ask. Are fillers really necessary? I get great accuracy, much better than minute of deer past reasonable deer range. A tight PRB is all you need IMHO.
 
MikeC said:
I've got to ask. Are fillers really necessary? I get great accuracy, much better than minute of deer past reasonable deer range. A tight PRB is all you need IMHO.

Sometimes they are necessary. My new GM 1:70 barrel will shoot single hole groups when I load with a felt wad. Remove the wad from the load and the groups open up to about an inch and a half. I think the deep grooves on the GM barrel make good use of a wad.

HD
 
I have no idea of what your post is trying to say. In no way will I fill the barrel with filler and put a PRB at the top. But if I did would the pressure of the black lighting and compressing the corn meal all the way down the barrel before moving the ball raise the pressure to the point of bulging the barrel or putting flack in my face as the barrel blows up?

What I want to know is what is the upper limit of 80 grn of black to corn meal filler, is there a percentage of black to filler?
 
Dawg, i'm trying to come up with a load that will work in 35 degree to - 35 degree weather. What i'm trying to do is isolate the powder from any lube or moisture. I hunt the high north of Wisconsin and I have had problems with ignition in the past on my cap lock with Pyrodex, but I have real black now.

Over wads are something I want to try, but to me if I can keep the lube away from the powder I won't contaminate the powder with moisture. What i'm trying to say is I want the dam thing to shoot the same if the temp drops.
 
I'm trying to isolate the black from all other factors, do I know what i'm doing, well of course, maybe, not sure, yes, and I think ect.
 
apache 130 said:
Dawg, i'm trying to come up with a load that will work in 35 degree to - 35 degree weather. What i'm trying to do is isolate the powder from any lube or moisture.
Just use mink oil for your patch lube and you'll have a great seal and it does not effect the powder in any way and the cold does not freeze the mink oil even in the temps you mention. That is the only lube I use for hunting. Hoppes for the range.
 
I don't think Paul was suggesting you fill the barrel with corn meal. I believe his point was that, while there probably is a practical upper limit, it's not something that anyone has been concerned about so it's not widely known. You probably don't reach that 'upper limit' until the amount of filler is beyond anything anyone would actually use.
 
Apache: You missed my point entirely. I was trying to tell you that there is NO practical upper limit, and I don't believe using more filler is going to burst a good barrel.

If I were shooting a .54 caliber gun, I would use 30 grains of corn meal by volume, no 40, but I don't think 40 is going to cause you any problems. That is the bottom line.

Would I double that to 80 grains? NO, but ONLY because I am CHEAP, and can see no additional benefit to using more corn meal!! I would not be worried about additional pressure, or even recoil.

If you are hunting Northern Wisconsin, and using Black Powder rather than Pyrodex, you should have no problem with misfires. However, I would be looking at your pre-shooting cleaning and your loading techniques to see if that is not the reason that you were having trouble with the Pyrodex. It could just be the design of the breech, with a Nock-style small powder chamber, and a right angle flash channel that is so small that pyrodex does not get down into the channel when you load the gun. Using FFFg Black Powder will improve matters.

You have to clean the oil out of your gun, and out of the flashchannel on a percussion gun, BEFORE you load the powder. Just firing off a couple of caps WON'T always do the job in all weather conditions. And, if the gun has been stored for any length of time, the oil may have changed to grease, and trying to burn it out is only going to leave a lot of burned, greasy residue in both the flash channel and the bore.

So, always take the time, to pour some alcohol down your barrel, and then shake or slosh the barrel back and forth, one hand blocking the muzzle, and the other blocking the vent hole or nipple. I always remove the nipple on my gun for this kind of cleaning, because the orifice is so small in the nipple. I don't want greasy crud cloggying the orifice behind an otherwise clean barrel. I put my thumb over the hole in either the patent breech, drum, or barrel where the nipple is screwed in, to keep the alcohol in the gun where it can do its job.

I pour the alcohol and gunk out of the barrel by turning the barrel up on end, so it comes out the muzzle. Its always amazes me what color the alcohol changes to, and the occasional floating carbon that come out, too. Easy to see if you pour the alcohol out into a clear jar, like a mayonaise jar. Then cleaning patches, first with alcohol, and then dry are run down the barrel to remove any remaining oils, and crud. A pipe cleaner through the flash channel or vent clear that of any remaining grease, or oil. A small drop of oil on the threads of the nipple, and the corresponding threads in the barrel or breech, and the nipple can be put back in the gun.

If I am contemplating a long drive to get to where I am hunting, I will run a very lightly oiled patch into the barrel just to prevent rust on the now bare bore. When I get to the place to hunt, I run a dry patch down to remove the oil, then load my gun.If I expect to be sitting on a stand, or think it may be some time before a shot is fired, I now run a lubed patch( with wonderlube) down the barrel to grease the barrel in front of the PRB or OS cards, so that the barrel is not rusting while I hunt. If the weather is sub-freezing, I will probably switch to using Ballistol for my patch lube, and for greasing the barrel.

I stopped firing off caps, other than on a range, years ago, to clear my gun, as I generally am hunting deer, and occasionally pheasants, with my shotgun, and I don't even slam the car door where I park my car, to keep from alerting or spooking game.

I also found out at a range one very hot, and humid July, that caps won't burn out oils. I suffered a number of misfires, until I took the nipple out, and gave the shotgun a thorough cleaning, as described above, with alcohol, pipe cleaner, etc-- the whole works. Only then did the gun go off reliably. In fact, it is the ONLY time I have ever suffered a " Hang Fire " in my life, shooting percussion.
 
apache 130 said:
Dawg, i'm trying to come up with a load that will work in 35 degree to - 35 degree weather. What i'm trying to do is isolate the powder from any lube or moisture. I hunt the high north of Wisconsin and I have had problems with ignition in the past on my cap lock with Pyrodex, but I have real black now.

Over wads are something I want to try, but to me if I can keep the lube away from the powder I won't contaminate the powder with moisture. What i'm trying to say is I want the dam thing to shoot the same if the temp drops.

Lubed wads will not contaminate the powder and they will perform just as well from 35 to -35. I'd rather use a wad then have corn meal caking in my barrel.

HD
 
If the meal is dry- ( warm it in an oven set at 200 edgrees, and then turned off before you put your open box or bag of meal on a cookie sheet in the oven) it will not " Cake ". I can be, and probably should be kept in a sealed plastic bag, the in a second bag with some desicant packs in the second bag, for long term storage. I carry my corn meal in a powder flask, and it stays dry enough during a day long hunt. I put the flask on a radiator, or near a heat register over night, and its dry again the next day, too. I would not hesitate to put it next to a stove, or even hot rocks bordering a camp fire overnight to dry if I was staying in a tent, or out in the open for a couple of days.
 
Living in the desert @ 3500 foot elevation I must take issue with the following statement
I hunt the high north of Wisconsin
After living in that state for two years I know for a fact that the highest point in the state of Wisconsin is about 1700 foot above sea level...

:rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

Sorry, coulden't help myself...

:blah: :rotf: :blah:
 
Living in the desert @ 3500 foot elevation I must take issue with the following statement: "I hunt the high north of Wisconsin." After living in that state for two years I know for a fact that the highest point in the state of Wisconsin is about 1700 foot above sea level...

OH YEAH!!! Ya think that's something, huh. Well I hunt on Driskill Mountain.

(The highest point in Louisiana is Driskill
Mountain at 535 feet above sea level.)
 
For the rest of the readers, he means he is living way up in the northern part of Wisconsin, near Lake Superior. For those of us who live in Illinois, and in Southern Wisconsin, we knew exactly what he meant. But thanks for the laugh. We do need to keep things in perspective. :rotf: :blah: :hatsoff:
 

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