Flintlock Skeet

[roundball]

In getting ready to start shooting some rounds of Flintlock skeet 'singles' with my .28ga Flint Hawken, given what I have on hand here's how I was planning to approach it.

I'll be using a "1/2 vest" which for the world reminds you of a "nail apron", except it has TWO sets of pockets in the front, one set layered in front of the other...and has a full width pocket across the back...not uncommon on skeet fields.
(particularly in high heat & humidity as they're cooler than full length shooting vests)

I'll be using premeasured charges in 35mm film canisters:
Powder charges in front pocket #1;
Cushion wads in front pocket #2;
Shot charges in front pocket #3;
Over shot cards in front pocket #4;

Dedicated range rod + small ziploc of dampened cleaning patches in one of the pockets in case I need to wipe the bore occasionally.



See any problems with this approach, or any suggestions to simplify it further ?

 

[Stumpkiller]

Seems like you got all the right parts in all the right places. Problem with pre-measured is you have to have seperate pockets for the full vs. someplace to drop the empties,so you'll need a "dump-pocket" too.

Or, you can use a shot snake and a flask + measure for the powder and not use pre-measured loads.

The snake dispenses 1, 1/1/8 or 1-1/4 oz at a time (depending on the setting) into a little scoop that is easy to pour into the bore.

 

[Many Klatch]

I have never done this, but I was talking with a guy that shoots skeet with a muzzleloader. He rigged up a shotshell reloader and a golf cart for an onsite loader. Place the gun in the golf cart, hit the powder bar, pull out the gun send down a wad, place the gun back in the cart, hit the shot bar pull out the gun and send down an overshot wad and ready to go. He claimed he could almost keep up with a standard foursome that way.

It sounds doable, and you wouldn't have to remember which pocket to dive into or worry about what to do with all the empties. If you try it I'd love to know how it works out.

Many Klatch

 

[silverfox]

Sounds good to me. I use a nail apron with 4 pockets most of the time. The other times I use a Cuban Guayabera shirt. The same thing 4 pocket in front. No flintlock so Ted Cash primer around neck. As was mentioned before for your empties why not carry a pouch like the sheet and trap shooter use for their empties.
That gun wagon for a loading station sounds like something I may try also it would be safer when around a group.
Best of luck.
Fox

 

[Dave K]

That should work fine. I like some of the others though, just use a flask and shot pouch, instead of a snake. But either will work. I personally use a turkey hunting vest, because it gives me all the pockets I need. If I were to use premeasured powder and shot, I could use the game pouch in back to toss the empty containers. Tied to my turkey hunting vest is a plastic golf club sleeve that usually would hold a golf club in a golf bag. I use the sleeve though to hold my ramrod with has a T handle on top, so I can just return the ramrod to the tube and let it drop in like a sword into a scabbard.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Its just a thought, but you might try Jim Rackham's system, where you use ONLY OS Cards, that have had off-center holes punched in them with an awl. That way, you eliminate two pockets of wads, of different size, and eliminate the possibility of putting the wrong wad in the barrel at the wront time. You certainly will carry much less " stuff".

A small short starter- light weight- like made from pine--- attached to a wrist loop so it can be dropped when not needed , but will swing back into the palm with a shake of the hand would be handy to push the cards and components into the muzzle( just deep enough so that you can build the load and wads) to get them started correctly, so that you can push the whole " package" or "LOAD" down the barrel on top of the powder with one stroke. I have tried the holed OS cards, and they are much faster to load than I had expected.

I am too acclimated, yet, to the system you are using, with the 3 different wads, to be comfortable with Jim's System, but I like it. It is proving to be faster for reloading. I just feel like a new shooter, as I have not eliminated unnecessary motion doing his system, so I feel a bit incompetent. I am sure that with exerience over several months, I will " smooth " out my loading technique, and I will be much faster.

I have carried both a shot snake, and a separate shot bag with the Irish measure, to measure out shot for this kind of shooting. It works fine. You just have to remember that you don't have to carry enough shot to shoot 100 clay targets in a row! I do use a dipper for measuring the powder charge, from a container, rather than my adjustable Powder measure, although I have used it, too. I just find it too slow. My plan is to determine a "pet " load for Skeet, Trap, Sporting Clays, and for the Quail Walk, and make fixed measures for the powder for each, dispensing with the need to carry more than one fixed measure for any such event. I can do the same for my hunting load. The fixed measures can then be put in the top tray of my range box, and the correct one removed for whatever event I am going to do.

 

[roundball]

In getting ready to start shooting some rounds of Flintlock skeet 'singles' with my .28ga Flint Hawken, given what I have on hand here's how I was planning to approach it.

I'll be using a "1/2 vest" which for the world reminds you of a "nail apron", except it has TWO sets of pockets in the front, one set layered in front of the other...and has a full width pocket across the back...not uncommon on skeet fields.
(particularly in high heat & humidity as they're cooler than full length shooting vests)

I'll be using premeasured charges in 35mm film canisters:
Powder charges in front pocket #1;
Cushion wads in front pocket #2;
Shot charges in front pocket #3;
Over shot cards in front pocket #4;

Dedicated range rod + small ziploc of dampened cleaning patches in one of the pockets in case I need to wipe the bore occasionally.

See any problems with this approach, or any suggestions to simplify it further ?

The half vest has a large open pocket across the back so the empties will drop right in there.

This whole Flintlock skeet shooting endeavor may only be a few weekends this spring and/or summer just for the actual hands on experience of it...so I'm not yet ready to commit to the expense of a shot snake & flask but I do see that they would work.
(just don't like buying too many specialty items until I know if I'm going to get in/stay in the game...been there / done that too many times :shake: )

I have a 1.5" ring on the belt of the half vest for the ramrod...big enough for the rod to easily slide through but not the 2" ball...if that doesn't do it I'll give the golf club tube a try.

 

[Grizzled Roberts]

Several of the primitive shoots I attend have clay birds as part of the smoothbore program. Of course being a primitive event We must use 18th century equipment. I have a smoothbore bag made by Fred Martin which has little pockets in the front for the wads. The powder comes from my horn
and the shot from a snake. I usually do not shoot more than a dozen shots a year as I like round ball! I have been shooting the primitive stuff so long that is the only gear I have. I could be discomunicated if plastic fell out of my pouch!!!

:bow:

 

[jdstrang]

He rigged up a shotshell reloader ... Place the gun in the golf cart, hit the powder bar, pull out the gun ...

Uhhh...

So he's pouring powder down the barrel from a drop charger to which a considerably larger reservoir of powder is attached? :hmm:

Maybe I'm not visualizing it correctly, but isn't this akin to, (or just one step removed from) pouring a charge from a horn directly down the barrel, which we all know to be a definite :nono:

Somehow, the device plays out in my mind's eye like a scene from "Caddyshack," with Rodney Dangerfield as the skeet-shooting golf-cart driver. Cook-off City, and hellzapoppin! :shocked2:

 

[roundball]

I could be discomunicated if plastic fell out of my pouch!!!

:grin: I understand...

For the record, I've never tried to pass myself off as any sort of devout traditionalist...I've enjoyed the learning curves of sidelocks and particularly Flintlock ignition technology itself, both rifles and smoothbores for the purposes of various forms of Flintlock hunting...but for some reason I've never developed an interest in a lot of the related items like horns, bags, etc. My interest is in the execution of the shots with the older technology as it relates to hunting deer, turkey, squirrels, etc, etc...not so much about items leading up to the shot like using a horn or bag.

For example I don't use plastic shot cups in the smoothbores as that would introduce modern plastic components into the shot itself. But using a handful of plastic film canisters to carry premeasured charges TO the range "prior to actually building and executing the shot" for some Flintlock skeet experimentation doesn't bother me at all...maybe my interest will expand into things like horns and bags later on.

 

[cptleo1]

Hey Roundball

These guys are all close.

All the pockets and containers very quickly get to be a PIA

The shot snake-powder flask is the way to go.

Paul's idea of only using 1 type of wad actually is a good idea and will give you better patterns.

I use a large CVA pistol flask ($20) with a large (35 gr) spout on it.

Shot snake with shoulder strap.(I believe TOW sells the shot nozzle for $16 - cobble together a denim bag to attach it to)

I keep the flask and wads (loose) in a small canvas haversack-

Probably got 50-60 bucks in the whole rig.

I have a large leather Fowler bag and it is more trouble than it is worth.

A lot depends on if you are shooting informally with friends (hand trap) or are shooting in an organized smokeless shoot.

The fumbling ,bumbling reloading process with 5 guys waiting on you gets kind of embarrassing.

The smokeless guys get impatient pretty quickly.

There are many ways to skin the cat on this one.

Have you seen what shot sells for lately ?

 

[Stumpkiller]

Shot snake with shoulder strap.(I believe TOW sells the shot nozzle for $16 - cobble together a denim bag to attach it to)

I got the head for mine from Dixie many moons ago and the leather (including the buckle) is from a ratty old salesman's sample bag someone gave me where I worked. :rotf: The Irish style has a removeable spout and the English style is a push-button dispenser with no removable tip.

 

[roundball]

No organized rounds with squads of regular skeet shooters :grin: ...don't even like shooting regular rounds of skeet with squads...takes too long, especially when standing in a line of 5 guys with 97* temps & matching humidity, and the sun hitting you with 140*.

I have off hours priviliges to the club and usually go right after first light on Saturday or Sunday mornings...take a lawn chair for my wife to sit and operate the cord for me...will do the same for this with the difference being a .28ga Flintlock instead of .28ga/.410 Remington 1100s.

My patterns are fine, and I've never had any problems managing both cushion wads & OS cards...was mainly wondering from people with actual hands on experience if there might have been any operations tips worth knowing about...suggestions about the snake & flask dully noted for possile use in the future.

 

[AJFedak]

I have been shooting blackpowder skeet for better than 5 years now. I use the Beretta O/U and shoot both organized and casual rounds.

When shooting organized squads I use the pre-measured powder and shot; and I can reload and keep the squad moving as long as there are at least 3 shooters. I will only shoot my singles, then hookup with another squad and shoot the doubles.

I use small plastic type containers I can get from work. The shot is measured into a 32 ga. hull and then slid into a 28 ga. hull. All empties go into the back-pouch on my jacket.

For wads,I use the over-shot cards, 3 over the powder and one over the shot (2 on the second barrel).

For casual shooting I setup a bench at station #4 and reload from powder-can-to-measure, and scoop the shot from a small plastic bucket. Walk to the staion shoot and repeat the process. We have casual shoots on the 4th Saturday of the month.

 

[ohio ramrod]

I use the same system I started out with in the early sixties. Wax paper paper cartridges for the premeasured powder. Felt wad . and newspaper paper cartridges for the shot.. This way I have the powder and shot both premeasured and no problem with empty tubes. I rip open the wax paper dump the powder down followed by the wax paper, one felt wad followed by unopened paper shot cartridge.For a 28 gauge (Which I often use a 1/2 inch doll rod makes a good mandralo to roll your paper cartridge on.

 

[roundball]

I use the same system I started out with in the early sixties. Wax paper paper cartridges for the premeasured powder. Felt wad . and newspaper paper cartridges for the shot.. This way I have the powder and shot both premeasured and no problem with empty tubes. I rip open the wax paper dump the powder down followed by the wax paper, one felt wad followed by unopened paper shot cartridge.For a 28 gauge (Which I often use a 1/2 inch doll rod makes a good mandralo to roll your paper cartridge on.

Hot dog...you got my attention !!

I'm already there with the paper powder charges...I see that working...I'll practice making / tearing / dumping a few in the garage over the holidays...and 25 of them in a pouch would take up a lot less room than 25 film canisters for sure...and as you say, nothing to discard.
But why wax paper...seems like newspaper would work as well, or does the wax paper present less of a fire hazard than the bulkier paper?

And...can you put some more words around the paper shot cartridges you mentioned...you put it in whole, unopened?
Is it undersized so it bursts when seated or at setback time?
What is the reliability?

 

[AJFedak]

Instead of using wax paper consider parchment paper. It is used for baking in the oven and has a higher flash point.

 

[dlpowell]

I was shooting informal trap back in the 70's with a dbl 12. Used toilet paper for over shot wadding. Wasn't a whole lot of bp info available back then. Had a double 28 too, used to carry paper cartridges with powder in one side and shot in the other. Used the paper for os wadding. Just get a dowel to make paper cartridges. Leave the cartridge on the dowel. Fill with shot or powder twist and tie. Remove and fill the other end. You can make 'em fairly quick.

 

[roundball]

Had a double 28 too

I'd "kill" to have a double .28ga Flintlock
:grin:

used to carry paper cartridges with powder in one side and shot in the other. Used the paper for os wadding. Just get a dowel to make paper cartridges. Leave the cartridge on the dowel. Fill with shot or powder twist and tie. Remove and fill the other end.

To keep the powder & shot separate, I assume you mean that you also tied in the middle...and carried cushion wads separately?

 

[Grizzled Roberts]

Paulvallandigham, Would you mind posting Jim Rackham's only OS cards system again? I wrote it down when you first posted it a while back. When you brought it back up I remembered the notes, but I can't find them and the original post has timed out from the back posts. Anything I can do to make my 12 primitive shots a year more accurate I will try it!

:bow: