Glass Bedding

[F.G. Ford]

I have glass bedded many center fire rifles, and a few badly inletted and cracked TC rifles.
However do you regular BP builders use glass bedding to prevent cracking in lock and tang areas, or do you rely on your skill of inletting.
The reason of my query.
I am building a .75 cal. Jaeger with wood (curly maple) to die for and do not want to risk any cracks.
Your guidance would be much appreciated.
Fred

 

[necchi]

Here's a long thread about this very issue from a few months back, about 53 responses.
Member M.D. describes his procedure pretty well.
http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/278874/post/1266893/hl//fromsearch/1/

 

[longrifle78]

Others may disagree, but if i were building a 75cal with highly figured wood i'd bed the breech & lug.

 

[wattlebuster]

I would bed the breech and tang and maybe the lugs :thumbsup:

 

[Stophel]

Epoxy is the gunsmith's crutch.

:wink:

Glass bedding is no stronger than the wood underneath it. And I have found that epoxy simply does NOT stick to wood well at all, flaking off badly (and I have tried many different types). Just due to its inflexibility, I suppose.

 

[Vaino]

I've used colored epoxy but only for repairs. Have never used epoxy for glass bedding or to "reinforce" the area behind the breech or tang....end grain hard maple doesn't "need help". The "modern mindset" rationalizes that if epoxy had been available in the time of the "original builders", they would have used it. Possibly so, but the plain fact is that they didn't have it.

Whatever one wants to use in the construction of a MLer, including epoxy, is up to the individual builder....but if a builder can do w/o it, a better, more HC product is the result......Fred

 

[longrifle78]

I wouldnt do it to strengthen the wood, i'd do it to insure 100% contact of the lug & breech. Theres a lot of recoil being absorbed by that area in a 75 and you want to make shure its absorbed evenly. If theres a high spot thats takin all the recoil then cracks can happen.
This is just my opinion and not ment to disagree or start an argument with those that said not to do it.

 

[tallbear]

Glass bedding was not used on 18th and 19th century firearms and has no place in the building of replica's of 18th and 19th century firarms either.

Mitch Yates

 

[rich pierce]

Agree. I'm always a bit mystified as to why folks choose muzzleloading then modernize it. If somebody wants improvement, center fire is an improvement. Just my approach.

 

[longrifle78]

Mild steel center drilled barrels, cast locks, machine made screws, bandsawn blanks & routed barrel inlets, All modern. But alittle acraglass in a place it will never bee seen is way outa line?

 

[necchi]

See Old Ford, that's why I posted that link, this is all the same stuff that got hashed out in the other one.
:shake:

 

[rich pierce]

Mild steel center drilled barrels, cast locks, machine made screws, bandsawn blanks & routed barrel inlets, All modern. But alittle acraglass in a place it will never bee seen is way outa line?

Whats new about wood and steel? If you ever look up fallacies in logic, this one just rolled out is a classic. It can be paraphrased, "Perfection cannot be achieved so let's eliminate all standards." Similar to saying, "Son, you can't get a perfect grade in school so just don't even try."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fallacies

 

[longrifle78]

My point was this aint 1770, no matter how hard we try our guns aint period correct, they are modern replicas of old time guns, so if someone wants to use a modern product that cant be seen on the finished product who cares. You see old guns all the time with cracks in the tang area that may have ben prevented if they were beded.
Its no diffrent than alot of knife makers use jb weld in the handle & nobody seems to have a problem with that.

 

[F.G. Ford]

My query regarding glass bedding is in no way intended to re-start the North/South agression :stir:
I agree in making a finely fitted long gun.
However a big old .75 canon ball rolling down a barrel will itroduce a lot of recoil, and I have no desire to repair cracks after I'm done.
There are no recoil lugs as a modern rifle may have.
I'm way too old to try and stuff 250 grains of 3f down the barrelk to see what is going to happen.
I look forward to looking at old posts to see their view points.
I also look forward to new generation beliefs and suggestions.
That is why I'm here.
All the best!
Fred

 

[rich pierce]

The recoil force generated by a .58 Minnie ball in an 1863 Springfield with the standard military load was pretty significant, as was the recoil of a Brown Bess or a percussion elephant rifle in 8 bore.

 

[rich pierce]

You see old guns all the time with cracks in the tang area that may have ben prevented if they were beded.

As far as I know this is not so. I am not aware of recoil induced cracked stocks being at all common. If they were thy would occur more often in big bore guns. Broken stocks are as likely to be found in .36 or .42 cal originals with 8 pound barrels as heavy caliber guns. Usually caused by bad grain direction and a fall with the gun.

Before assuming glass bedding would have prevented such breaks and that such breaks are caused by recoil which is somehow negated by glass bedding, I'd want to see some real tests supporting this hypothesis.

But if it gives some piece of mind, and modern materials don't bother a fella, whether its effective or not, it may have a placebo effect.

 

[Stophel]

I rarely see old guns broken at the wrist or tang area (and even then, it has nothing to do with the breech bedding). Even with some REALLY BAD grain alignment. Most breaks seem to be in the lock area, where the wood is thinnest. And they're broken because they were dropped or used as a club, or otherwise mishandled, not because the barrel breech was not well fitted.

:wink:

I'm of the not-so-humble opinion that if one cannot (and consequently, refuses to) properly inlet the parts of a gun, that person might do well to seek another craft at which he may be more handy. :grin:

 

[longrifle78]

Ican inlet a barrel just fine. I like how on these forums anyone who disagrees with the ''chosen ones'' are tarred & feathered and tryed to be chased away.

 

[necchi]

Yeah and I used to be a guy that hadn't studied too.
Then I began paying attention a bit, it's amazing I found out I could actually learn something, :wink:
:v

I don't think anybody really get's chased away, they just find it uncomfortable when they don't follow or have other means than the traditional values that make up this forum.
I mean just look at the title of the Forum,
"Keeping Tradition Alive"
:idunno:

 

[longrifle78]

Im all for tradition but that wasnt what this thread was about, it was started to ask if a beded breech was stronger. It is , and thats a fact. If that bothers a couple people on their high horse im sorry.