GPR .54 flint experiences & question

[daveol]

I have been lurking and diligently reading the forum for many months. I thank all for the wonderful cache of information available here.
I recently put together a Lyman .54 GPR in flint. The following are my experiences (long) and question (short).
On my first trip to the range, my goals and expectations were simple;
1) Make smoke and move lead through the barrel to break it in. I took the advice gleaned from reading the list to

 

[Stumpkiller]

Welcome!

With respect to the different ingredients contained in Moose Snot & Moose Milk, under what circumstances is one patch lube used versus the other? Would lube containing beeswax be more suitable for warm hot shooting conditions? For between shot wiping, continue dry or should I use alcohol or lube?

Don't wipe dry! You'll eventually jamb a patch & jag solidly. I either use a spit damp patch or a little moose milk on a patch. Alcohol would work, but water will to. You don't need it sopping wet, just damp. A bit of Moose Snot also works for between shot wiping, and a wipe before the first shot of the day makes the loading easier for the rest of the day. I liken this to greasing a pan before cooking.

As to when to use the wax vs. liquid lubes it depends mostly on your shooting style and the rifle's preferences. I set about to make a lube that was not runny for use in my bullet blocks when I made the Moose Snot. T/C Natural Lube was a runny mess in the summer. Both the milk and the Snot are very stable over the temperatures I have encountered: -15

 

[Java Man]

I would suggest wiping the bore between nearly every shot with a damp patch as Stumpy stated. You will/should get the most consistent results that way. And there are not too many occasions where you need to speed load. Except for hunting situations. Stumpy's Moose Snot should really shine there.

You might also back your load off a little. That's an elk load there. Probably 70 FFFg is plenty for deer in a .54, and 50 FFFg might be a good start for target load.

Stumpy, I'm going to try the Moose Snot for target shooting with wiping between shots. What ya think?

Gregg

 

[cayugad]

The reason I use moosemilk for the patch lube is in hot weather, I can spritz the patch from a pump spray bottle and the then damp patch acts as a swab at the same time. I have shot numerous times without ever having to swab the barrel and the accuracy with the damp moosemilk pillow tick patch is excellent.

The only time I swab is when the accuracy of the rifle starts to fall off, or I am having trouble reaching my witness mark on the ramrod. I then swab my flintlocks and sidelocks with 91% isopropyl alcohol. After a alcohol patch both sides, I then run two dry patches down the barrel. The alcohol is almost all gone anyway, and the dry patches pick up any small amount of fowling left from the damp swab.

I stopped using T/C #13, water, and even mixtures of alcohol and something else in the flintlocks and sidelocks because I noted more hang fires, slow fires, and no fires. I could only credit this with too damp a patch of the substance. So I cut back on the amount of wetness to the patch and ended up getting one or two stuck in the barrel. With alcohol I can get a good damp patch, swab the barrel, and by the second dry patch they are normally dry themselves when they come up.

Whether this will help or not.. all rifles are different, but my .54 caliber Lyman Trade Rifle shoots better with Goex 2f then 3f. I do shoot 90 grains, as recommended by the book with a moose milk damp patch and a .530 roundball. I tried to load a .535 and would have needed a hammer to seat it... All rifles are a mystery unto themselves..

Good luck with your rifle. Keep making smoke and it will come together. You might also want to add a wonderwad if the patches are getting blown. It helps in some of my rifles...

:thumbsup:

 

[Kaw Trooper]

I have been shooting my GPR .54 Flint, for just a short time now.

I have found the barrel needs a lot of cleaning to begin with. Hoppie's did the trick. Soak it, Soak it, Soak it. I'm switch to natural later.

I changed the adjustable rear sight to the fixed one. Ended up filing the front down about 35-45% for a 100 yard shot with 65g ( holding 10" high )

Was having a lot of trouble with non sparking from the Lyman lock. With the english flints even. Switched to a L&R lock with better results, but still not perfect. I'm learning..

Clean after 3rd round. Clean the pan every time on humid days. Wipe the flint also. Use the pick. And OPEN UP THE VENT HOLE with your drill bit.

When everything goes right I'm hitting a 10" or less, circle at 100 yards, on my elbows.

As we both are new to the GPR, please feel free to email or message me.

 

[Old40Rod]

My GPR .50 percussion doesn't seem to like ox-yoke prelube patches either. I switched entirely to liquid. Try Hoppe's BP lube if you need something off the shelf. Its liquid, just a bit of thickness to it. Try it until you run into a moose with a cold.

Ditto on trying .530s and thinner patches. Most of the fun is in trying different things and finding the right combination that works for your rifle.

:imo:

 

[Stumpkiller]

Stumpy, I'm going to try the Moose Snot for target shooting with wiping between shots. What ya think?

It works for me. That is, in my rifles it is very accurate. Some guys that have tried it claim it gives stringing, but everyone loads and wipes a bit different. If you wipe between, I imagine you'll do fine. I suspect the "trick" is to use as little as possible. You can hardly tell by looking that my lubed patches are lubed. They're just a bit darker from the moisture, no globs or layers of lube. I've posted a couple 1" three-shot offhand groups I've shot with the Moose Snot & wiping between system (Just laying a cleaning patch on my tongue while I pull the rod and wiping with that). That's with my 84 gr hunting load in the .50 cal.

Every gun is a bit different and you have to change one thing at a time until you fine the best combination.

And then there are times it's just nice to use the fastest and easiest method even if it does cost a bit of accuracy.

 

[TarletonRanger]

I'm as well interested in learning more about the GPR flinters as I am about to pick one up myself. However, it will be a "Hunter" model with the fast twist barrel for conicals.

The biggest questions I have are in regards to making lock time as fast as possible, as well as having good ignition. As this will be my fist flinter, I'm sure it will be a learning experience getting it ready for the upcoming deer season.

Any hints on what folks have found on GPR locks that require some work will be greatly appreciated. I'll warn ya'll right now though, I'm a young fellar, (21), and sometimes require that techniques be spelled out slowly. :front:

Shoot straight pards!

Jake

 

[Darkhorse]

You are very very lucky you didn't get the ramrod stuck in the barrel wiping with that bare patch. It only takes once to learn a good lesson. I take a small bottle of water just for quick cleaning every range trip, of course a wet spit patch works just as well.
After shooting the GPR for a few years I can offer a couple of opinions:
You are shooting low and to the right because you have not quite mastered the flintlock. It is different than any other type gun. After you master it you will find your groups tighten up drastically.
Until you change or alter your touchhole liner you will continue to have accuracy, flinching, ignition problems.
The GPR barrel is very accurate but rough. It needs about 200 shots to help smooth it out.
Use .0175 pillow ticking. The good stuff you buy in a fabric store by the yard. Your rifling will cut the stuff sold by Ox Yoke.
A load of 80 grains 3F is a dandy deer load for that rifle but its a little hot for pleasureable shooting. Also it will leave a lot of fouling which is what you are running into after 3 or so shots. Back it off to 40 grains for practice, use Wonder Lube and you can shoot all day with little or no cleaning.
Also for practice, use those prelubed .010 patches and 40 grains of 3F. Easy to load and pleasant to shoot. So what if it tears it a little, practice should be fun right?
Instead of holding the GPR in the pocket of the shoulder, try holding it lower, on your upper bicep instead. You will find the gun settles better and the sights line up better. It has been said this type buttplate was designed to be shot from the upper arm. I believe it after trying it.
To repeat: Shooting a flintlock is different. A person can flinch and not know it. But the target will let you know. Do a search on this forum for cures for flinching. Your goal is to never know when the flint strikes the frizzen. The problem is, most people subconciously look at the lock at the last minute. Even if everything else is perfect your accuracy is ruined.
You can't test the rifle until the shooter gets himself fixed.
Been there. Done that.

 

[CoyoteJoe]

When starting to work up loads with a new barrel I would always start with a light powder charge, say 50 gr. 3f and work upward only after having arrived at a satisfactory combination of patch, ball and lube. There are so many variables to deal with that the object is to eliminate one issue at a time, with as little fuss, bother and expense as possible.
In that reguard, little fuss, bother and expense, I start with a ball .010" under bore size and at least a .020" patch and usually thicker, .027" canvas or .032" denim cut on th muzzle. My reason for the thick patching is that it eliminates one variable right off, I never worry about burning or blowing a patch with the thick stuff.
And leave all the wierd lube concoctions at home! Lube with spit, it swabs the bore as you load each shot so no swabbing is required, you can shoot all day with spit patches and never swab. One more variable eliminated, there is no better lube for range shooting and by not swabbing between shots there is no ignition problem from wet fouling pushed into the patten breech as will happen when swabbing the barrel every shot.
With that formula, .530" ball, spit patch of .020"+ and 50gr of 3f you should see 50 yard groups under 2" right off.
And you don't have to spend a day's wages on prelubed patches and secret formula cleaning solutions.
Keep it simple, at least to start and work up your hunting load after you start to see some good groups with light loads and spit patches.
And always remember---- :results:

 

[daveol]

Thank You Stumpkiller and all those that replied.
I took a trip to wallmart and picked up some red and white pillow ticking, as well as a cream collored cloth that is a little thicker. I think it was called cotton twill. I also picked up the ingredients for Moosemilk.

Don't wipe dry! You'll eventually jamb a patch & jag solidly...... You are very very lucky you didn't get the ramrod stuck in the barrel wiping with that bare patch. It only takes once to learn a good lesson.....

Done that already.
I ended up hooking the handle of my rangerod on the lip of the bench, and working the rifle back and forth like a slidehammer.
Upon extraction patch looked quite nasty.

..You are shooting low and to the right because you have not quite mastered the flintlock. It is different than any other type gun. After you master it you will find your groups tighten up drastically.....

Possibly so, however I haven't touched the sights since I drifted them into position after browning the barrel and sights. I lined them up by eye on the centerline of the barrel. I was getting two inch groups low and right my first trip out.
It was my second excurrsion to the range when everything went to Hades.

I hope to be able to get to a range sometime in the next week.
I have both .530 & .535 balls as well as new patch and lube to experiment with.

I will report back after my next trip to the range.

Dave

 

[Rat]

I agree, no dry patching.

:nono:

I wipe my bore well every three shots. While breaking in the rifle, I certainly would not eliminate wiping the bore. Shame on the rangemaster.

:curse:

Play a lot with different size balls and patching. I'm finding that a small-ball and thick patch works good for me. Definately try a .530" ball and thicker patch, in fact the smaller ball would have been better for a baseline, and then a larger ball and thinner patch later to see if it shot better.

I don't think 80 grains is hot for a .54". But I would agree that to just break in the barrel and gun a lighter load is good. But again, I would not blame a 80 grain load for any problems, and would want at least that much for a hunting load.

I'd use a wonder wad under the ball to establish your base line, and then eliminate it later, as a single variable, if you have some objection to using it on a regular basis. It will reduce fouling and protect the patch to a large degree.

No offense to Coyote Joe, but I'd stick with a lube for now, and then see if you want to be a tick-licker later.

I've had very good results with Wonder Lube 1000+, and it will allow quite a few shots without wiping, although I wipe every three shots even so, or for consistancy. (although when shooting a single shot pistol the other day, I only wiped when it needed it)

You might find ffg to work better when you up your charges. Stay at 80 or less and you should get a good baseline with fffg.

I've tried wiping with alcohol a little bit, and it seems to work well indeed, though at the range I just use Hoppe's #9+. I think it would be perfect for "in the field" use. I use pure, unadulterated Everclear, "Mountain Dew" or White Lightning or whatever you want to call it. I'm not much of a drinker, but just in case I ever needed something of "medicinal" value, there it is in the possibles! I also use it in my alcohol stove for the same reason! Stove fuel, bore-cleaner and medicine all in one! Anyhow, alcohol probably is a good idea for patent-type breeches, as far as in-between wiping goes. I only have flat breech guns, which of course are not so persnickity, so it's not a big issue.

Actually I do have a pistol now with the powder-chamber/patent type breech. D'oh! No just kidding, it seems to work fine. Given a choice though....ooops...getting off topic!

ff:

Good luck.

Rat