Graf & Sons Powder

barebackjack · Apr 10, 2006

Was just looking at the Graf & Sons website (thanks JOHN12865), noticed they have their own label of powder as well as the Goex brand. Anybody use it? Its a whole 50 cents cheaper a pound!!!!! (for us penny pinchers)

Boone

Cherokee · Apr 10, 2006

I ordered 2 cans to try.
They probably make more of a profit on it than the other brands by having it made with there name on it.
I hope its good stuff, I like seeing somebody come out with a new spin or product and I will throw them a few bucks to help out.

TANSTAAFL · Apr 10, 2006

It is now all I use, is made by the same company and identical to Schuetzen BP.

john12865 · Apr 10, 2006

barebackjack said:
Was just looking at the Graf & Sons website (thanks JOHN12865), noticed they have their own label of powder as well as the Goex brand. Anybody use it? Its a whole 50 cents cheaper a pound!!!!! (for us penny pinchers)

Boone

No problem, Friends Don't Let Friends Shoot Pyrodex! :grin:

Sharp Shooter · Apr 10, 2006

TANSTAAFL said:
It is now all I use, is made by the same company and identical to Schuetzen BP.

Have you ever shot Goex powder? Is it cleaner than Goex?

TANSTAAFL · Apr 10, 2006

Yep & Yep, IMHO.

Sharp Shooter · Apr 10, 2006

TANSTAAFL said:
Yep & Yep, IMHO.

Have you shot Swiss or KIK? How would you compare it to those powders?

TANSTAAFL · Apr 10, 2006

The Swiss in no doubt hotter, maybe a bit cleaner. The KIK have never used.

Sharp Shooter · Apr 10, 2006

TANSTAAFL said:
Yep & Yep, IMHO.

So it is cleaner than Goex, right? I want to shoot real blackpowder but something cleaner than Goex. Swiss is not that much cleaner than Grafs though is it?

Old Ironsights · Apr 10, 2006

If'n y'all guys can be a bit patient, hopefully by next week I will have a side-by-side over-chrony comparison of Goex, GoexExpress, Swiss and KIK - including pics of fouling on a Stainless Steel Flinter (will show fouling nicely).

I will first fire a couple of fouling shots then clean with water and a bore snake.

My plan is to shoot a 50gr load behind a standard OxYoke/Natural Lube PRB.

#1 - get chrony data
#2 - snap pic of frizzen/touch hole.
#3 - disassemble gun/breech shoot pic of breech & bore.
#4 - Clean gun with water & bore-snake & reassemble.

All charges will be sifted and volumetrically loaded FFF in both the pan and tube.

The second string of tests will mimic the first, but use 100gr BP over PRB (to mimic magnum overloads that folks with modern guns are likely to try)

The third test will be 5-shot, 50gr strings over the chrony to get SD of powders, with cleaning between powder types.

Targets will be as good as I can shoot them from a bench over the chrony, but I make no claims to being remotely good at holding a group.

Hope for good weather guys. That's 30 shots and 12 cleanings.

Should make for a fun day. :winking:

Sharp Shooter · Apr 10, 2006

Old Ironsights said:
If'n y'all guys can be a bit patient, hopefully by next week I will have a side-by-side over-chrony comparison of Goex, GoexExpress, Swiss and KIK - including pics of fouling on a Stainless Steel Flinter (will show fouling nicely).

How about Grafs? Will that be in there? You should name the topic "Powder Tests"

Old Ironsights · Apr 10, 2006

RE: Graf & Schutzen

If I had access to some, I would, but PowderInc doesn't carry Graf or Schutzen (no point in even attempting Elephant). The five assorted pounds I just bought sort of busted me for a bit too...

I'll see about those after the Spring Shoot. I'll have one of my crew pick me up a can of each.

Rebel · Apr 10, 2006

Well, it looks like you have been at this long enough to know to avoid Elephant.

Old Ironsights · Apr 10, 2006

Rebel said:
Well, it looks like you have been at this long enough to know to avoid Elephant.

It was my experience with Elephant (as the only locally available BP where I was) that set me on the path of substitutes for my BuckHunter pistol and ROA.

That and I just wasn't shooting enough to warrant ordering even 5 lbs, much less a case.

But now I have a Flint and shoot between 1 and 3 guns at least monthly and have been showed how/where to order powder, so all is good.

Butch Speer · Apr 11, 2006

I don't recognize the name but here is who makes Graf & Sons powder according to the web site description.
"A new formulation developed by Wano Schwarzpulver of Germany for Graf & Sons utilizing premium grade alder charcoal. Alder is one of the most preferred bases for sporting black powder due to it's low residue and fouling characteristics as well as shot to shot, lot to lot consistency."

Slake · Apr 11, 2006

bore snake? how do you use that?

TANSTAAFL · Apr 11, 2006

William (The Mad Monk of black powder) Knight has analyzed Graf's and stated it is exactly the same composition as Schuetzen BP.

Verboten to post link .

Sharp Shooter · Apr 11, 2006

Grafs is cheaper and you don't need to order a certain amount of powder at a time.

TANSTAAFL · Apr 12, 2006

I order at least five pound minimum. But some here have stated before there is no minimum, yet here is what they say on their site under FAQ.

Q: What is the minimum quantity of powder/primers I can order?

A: The minimum order of powder is 4 lbs. The minimum order for primers is 1,000 primers.

shmrck1 · Apr 12, 2006

SharpShooter,
Its best to order what you can afford
and store safely because of the Hazmat fee which
at Graf&Sons is $20 weather you order one pound
or 25pounds. I think the $20 is standard wherever
you order from. You can store B/P almost indefinately without hurting quality. Just an opinion.
snake-eyes :hmm:

Graf & Sons Powder

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