Has anyone soldered on an under-rib?

[Gooddaytoya!]

From what I know, you have to tin the under rib. I take that to mean that the bottom flat of my barrel needs to be tinned also. I tried looking up how to tin long pieces of steel like that. The closest I can get to it is to rub sal - ammoniac on the part while running the solder right up against the block, while the parts are heated high enough to accept tinning. Uhm... What if the thimbles fall off the rib? I hope the thimbles are silver soldered! (Other than that I do know how to solder, and that the parts need to be spanking clean and preferably sanded to remove all oxides. And to use your favorite flux.)

 

[longcruise]

I have soldered ribs by cleaning both surfaces to bare shiny metal and laying down a small bead of soldering paste. Apply heat! I did this with no thimbles attached and later did the thimbles the same way BUT applied heat to the thimbles only. I do believe that applying the heat that way is considered incorrect, but it worked for me.

 

[waarp8nt]

I'm not an expert, only done it once, here is what worked for me. I soldered my rib on by tinning both parts, you might be able to get by with just tinning one part. After the rib was on and cooled down, I then soldered on the thimbles one at a time using a modified C-clamp to hold the thimble in place.

 

[muzzlediscipline]

As a generalization solder tends to bleed towards the source of heat. Clean and smooth, fluxed, and then heated each part (the rib and barrel in this case) gets the solder till it flows. Then put them together (bailing wire wrapping will help to keep them in place) and heat at the joint adding small amount of solder to keep it all flowing as you run the length of the joint. It would be ideal if you had a furnace large enough to put the entire assembly in but a torch will do it. IF you tin the areas where the thimbles will go when you tin the barrel side of the rib then tin the thimbles when you clamp them together and heat them to join there shouldn't be enough heat migrating to the barrel joint to loosen it. Again bailing wire it all together tightly can save some aggravation.

my $.02 and worth what you paid for it

 

[Gooddaytoya!]

As a generalization solder tends to bleed towards the source of heat. Clean and smooth, fluxed, and then heated each part (the rib and barrel in this case) gets the solder till it flows. Then put them together (bailing wire wrapping will help to keep them in place) and heat at the joint adding small amount of solder to keep it all flowing as you run the length of the joint. It would be ideal if you had a furnace large enough to put the entire assembly in but a torch will do it. IF you tin the areas where the thimbles will go when you tin the barrel side of the rib then tin the thimbles when you clamp them together and heat them to join there shouldn't be enough heat migrating to the barrel joint to loosen it. Again bailing wire it all together tightly can save some aggravation.

my $.02 and worth what you paid for it

Good clean advice guys. I'm thinking about about putting a heat sink inside the thimbles so they don't fall off. I'm thinking the heat sink would be small pieces of damp terry cloth towel. That might cause the spine solder under the thimbles to not adhere, but that would only be too short lengths along the spine. I think my sal-amoniac information is wrong for this application.. I'll just use my favorite flux. I can bring the entire barrel up to 375°, just with my propane torch, because I have a non contact thermometer so I have good control over the heat. I think 375° is the temperature I should go for, am I right about that?

 

[muzzlediscipline]

try soldering the rib to the barrel first as it is the largest heat mass. Then the thimbles to the rib. Even if you over heat the rib getting the solder to flow on the thimbles it is unlikely you will flow more than a short section of the rib/barrel joint and if you have everything wired tightly together should be no harm.

 

[cannonball1]

I've done it once and it didn't go well. First I drilled and sloted the ribs using thimbles for a full stock. soldering them in place worked well. Then I flattened some solder, fluxed both sides and set the rib on top of bottom flat of the barrel which was pointing up. I then rubbbed graphite where I did want it to stick. Applied the heat and the barrel bowed. To much heat I guess.

Since then I have seen an expert do it. He did every thing I did except he didn't flat the solder he tinned both sides in several spots close together. He could see exactly when the solder flowed. It was a great job.

 

[ZUG]

I silver braze the pipes to the rib first then I tin the rib and barrel then I place the rib in position on the barrel secure with clamps and heat the assembly starting at the muzzle and start flowing the solder back toward the breach adding solder as needed. When complete I checks for voids if none I clean it all up and remove any excess solder. You can't learn this from the written words but you have to do it to understand it.

 

[Bad Karma]

I have done it with Solder-it Paste and it worked so much better than previous attempts with conventional Solder. I heated the barrel with my heat gun before bringing the torch into play.

 

[Gordoncourtney]

Yes I made these barrels last year The lead free solders won’t work on steel. Old fashioned lead solder difficult to find not tried plumbers solder , Did it on gas stove with three burners going and the wife was out I used an etch flux. Although the top British gun barrel makers seem to prefer a tree resins. Study utube

Winters damp upon us found rust on my wall hangers



However on my 1853 Reilly the rib was lifting I decided to repair it with epoxy resins

 

[Old Hawkeye]

The epoxy compounds available today are stronger than a soldered joint. No need for heat or the associated discoloring of any bluing. I have installed/repaired several ribs & thimbles without any issues. Dye it black & wipe off any excess that squishes out of the joint & it is invisible. Can't imagine ever soldering again.

 

[Larry (Omaha)]

The epoxy compounds available today are stronger than a soldered joint. No need for heat or the associated discoloring of any bluing. I have installed/repaired several ribs & thimbles without any issues. Dye it black & wipe off any excess that squishes out of the joint & it is invisible. Can't imagine ever soldering again.

I did not know epoxy was stronger than solder. (Interesting comment) Call me old fashioned, but solder is nice and neat, traditional, and not difficult if you know the process. Zug nailed the rib/thimble procedure to a Tee. A higher temp silver braze for the thimbles will keep them on when using a lower temp solder for the rib.
Larry

 

[Gordoncourtney]

Oxygen bottles are now expensive. But for insurance against this Colvic black Death I bought a £225 Chinese’s oxygen concentrator now redundant. Still with my old gas welding torch using propane and the concentrators oxygen I can brass / bronze small items not to mention silver solder. I could not get enough heat to braze two 1/2” copper pipes together but great for small items I am building a big 6ft 2”dia tube full of nitrogen absorbing granules to get more oxygen. Just another project

 

[Gooddaytoya!]

Good clean advice guys. I'm thinking about about putting a heat sink inside the thimbles so they don't fall off. I'm thinking the heat sink would be small pieces of damp terry cloth towel. That might cause the spine solder under the thimbles to not adhere, but that would only be too short lengths along the spine. I think my sal-amoniac information is wrong for this application.. I'll just use my favorite flux. I can bring the entire barrel up to 375°, just with my propane torch, because I have a non contact thermometer so I have good control over the heat. I think 375° is the temperature I should go for, am I right about that?

I did not know epoxy was stronger than solder. (Interesting comment) Call me old fashioned, but solder is nice and neat, traditional, and not difficult if you know the process. Zug nailed the rib/thimble procedure to a Tee. A higher temp silver braze for the thimbles will keep them on when using a lower temp solder for the rib.
Larry

I sure am sorely tempted to use epoxy. The kind that takes 24 hours to cure is much much stronger than 5-minute epoxy and is not brittle. I would thicken it with a little cab - o- sil. Then I could use the rest to bed the barrel. Call me New Age. In the meantime I'm going to experiment by soldering pieces of store-bought steel together.

 

[BadDaditood]

Hey Sal, careful with that Ammoniac!!!

“Exposure to Ammonium Chloride is moderately hazardous, causing irritation, shortness of breath, cough, nausea, and headache. Most exposure is a result of contact with the fume form of this chemical (Ammonium Muriate Fume and Sal Ammoniac Fume), which is a finely divided particulate dispersed in the air.”

 

[BadDaditood]

Yes, tin both sides. First warm with heat gun to above dewpoint (if you torch cold steel you will see condensation until it warms up)
I’ve had good luck using a Sharpie wherever I Don’t want solder to stick, much easier cleanup.
I was going to solder the rib on the Harpers Ferry I’m building but the football is too good… maybe Monday

 

[Gordoncourtney]

I quite like epoxy gluing my sights to the barrel. I change them sometimes and they just knock off with a gentle hammer tap You need a fair gluing area so not always a practical method. It all started as my 577-500 no 2 double rifle 1885 came with no sights and the only way forward was to use epoxy as below

 

[TexiKan]

Years ago, when I was putting together my kit Sharon Hawken, I tried to solder the rib with a propane torch. I was not having any success. I took it to a friend who repaired musical instruments and he had a hotter torch and eventually the solder stuck and I simply did the clean up. Yeah, my first and only time.

 

[cannonball1]

I've done it once and it didn't go well. First I drilled and sloted the ribs using thimbles for a full stock. soldering them in place worked well. Then I flattened some solder, fluxed both sides and set the rib on top of bottom flat of the barrel which was pointing up. I then rubbbed graphite where I did want it to stick. Applied the heat and the barrel bowed. To much heat I guess.

Since then I have seen an expert do it. He did every thing I did except he didn't flat the solder he tinned both sides in several spots close together. He could see exactly when the solder flowed. It was a great job.

That should say did NOT want it stick where the graphite was placed