Heavy conicals

[DeX Glenn]

What is the heaviest conicals you guys shoot in the Hawken 50 cal Thompson Center?

 

[Walks with fire]

I don't currently own a .50 1/48 twist Hawken but I think you would be fine with a flat based conical of .781 or shorter and cupped base bullet like the Hornady Great Plains can be a bit longer.

The TC Maxi-hunter in 350 grains is a flat based bullet which is .750 long (.505 dia.) and should be an outstanding bullet with an overpowder wad. The Hornday Great Plains is .850 long (.509 dia.)but has a cupped base that is .140 deep so it should work quite well also. How well they shoot may depend on how well they fit your bore; undersized can be paper patched to help. I don't know what the TC Maxi-balls measure but they may be good as well. I don't think you can beat the Hornady Great Plains swagged soft lead bullet in my opinion and the 410 version may be just a bit long to fully stabilize. It may look good on the target paper but may not track thru game well if not fully stabilized. Try to stick to a bullet that is close to max length and you can shoot max charges; shorter bullets will give better accuracy with lower charges on down the ladder but some bullets just won't group no matter what you do; they just have to be tested.

The guys that have them and shoot them will chime in eventually; I am just running the numbers at this point but they do hold true in most applications. Google up the Greenhill formula and run your own calculations and test them against your range results on a calm day.

 

[Dphar]

What is the heaviest conicals you guys shoot in the Hawken 50 cal Thompson Center?

The typical conical, 350 grains or so, is plenty heavy for the gun its being shot in. The 48" twist will marginally stabilize a 2 caliber long bullet. If you want to shoot 650-700 gr bullets you need a 22 or 24" twist. But you will not be able to get much velocity out of it. The only 50-90 Sharps I built specifically for heavy bullets weighs about 17 pounds and the guy loves it. But he shoots it farther than is normal for a ML like a TC.

Once past a certain bullet weight and powder charge you need a rifle that has a design suitable for heavy recoil. Like a 1800-1860 British sporting rifle from Manton or Purdey
So shooting a heavy bullet is not that practical. Can't make good velocity for hunting etc. If shooting heavy game they tend to not track straight through the animal when fired from a 48 twist since they are marginally stable.
There are other problems as well. Nipple erosion is the first thing that is noticed (after recoil).
Dan

 

[Rat Trapper]

If the conical bullet is very long you will need a faster twist. In a 1-48 TC 50 cal Hawken rifle I use the Hornady great plains 385 grain bullet with a felt wad over powder. In the 54 cal I like the Hornady great plains 390 grain bullet. In smaller calibers I use PRB as these rifles are my target or small game rifles.

 

[Deadeye]

I had Veral Smith of LBT make me a .50 cal mould for a 500 gr. flat nose bullet. That bullet has proved to be very accurate in fast twist barrels
and almost as accurate in 1/48 barrels. 4" groups at 200 from 1/28" or 6 to 7" from 1/48 at 200 yds.
I've made 2 kills on bucks at over 200, one at 221 and another at 248 with the 1/28". many bucks and bulls have been killed, by others than myself, with one shot and only one bullet has ever been recovered. This bullet doesn't look that much different from a Buffalo or Hornady bullet but performs much different. Anyway, all that to say, although what's been said is generally true, some heavy conicals may shoot well in 1/48" twist.
Deadeye

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

I shoot the 370 grain T/C Maxi-Balls in .50 cal. and for best accuracy I always use an over-powder pre-lubed wonder-wad. In my Lyman Trade Rifle I use 72 grains of 3Fg Goex. This load is extremely accurate: In October I shot a perfect 50x50-2X off-hand with my cap lock from 50 yards.

The "trick" to shooting huge chunks of hot lead is to brush the bore with lead cleaner and a good brush, not just using hot water or a black powder solvent to clean the gun. I do this every couple of boxes of conicals (20 to a box) AFTER using the black powder solvent, and prior to using oil before storage. Changing-out nipples is also a good idea! If the hammer comes back to half-cock all on it's own--you MIGHT want to check & change the nipple! Nipple erosion happens sooner than you think when shooting huge conicals!

Commercially off-the-shelf conicals do vary in size and weight, so check yours if you notice some going down the bore easier than others of the same manufacture.

A good while ago T/C made the 470 grain .50 cal. Maxi's--but not now! One of those launched at almost 1400 fps with 90 grains of 3Fg wreaks havoc on watermelons R. Lee Ermey style :shocked2: . That loading is a Scout Camp favorite, with smiles guaranteed :haha: :rotf: so I only shoot the 470's once in a year to do the demo these days.

Hope that I've been some help and have a great Christmas!

Dave

 

[nw_hunter]

The heaviest I've shot is the Lyman 425 grn Shocker in 50 cal.

 

[Vaino]

Had excellent 100 yd accuracy w/.50 cal. 410 gr Buffalo Bullets over 100grs 2f and .018 pillow ticking. Shot 1 adult cow elk w/ this load and she only went 40 yds. Stopped using the BBs because they came off the powder charge in a clean bbl and the midrange height allowed only a 60 yd zero......Fred

 

[ohio ramrod]

Others may have more experience but for my self shooting a hollow based mini of the civil war style about lengths 1.5 to 1.75 bore diameter is the longest I have been able to stabilise in a 1/48 twist. With the hollow bases this gives me a mini of about 1.66 the weight of a round ball. The major advantage over a prb that I have found is in deformation and the "shock " effect rather than a heavier projectile. The round balls recovered from oak back stops are deformed but still reconisable as having been balls. The recovered mini's are just a flat glob. And unless the wood is over two inches thick it is "shattered and split" where as a rond ball passing through just leaves a splintered hole.

 

[Dphar]

I had Veral Smith of LBT make me a .50 cal mould for a 500 gr. flat nose bullet. That bullet has proved to be very accurate in fast twist barrels
and almost as accurate in 1/48 barrels. 4" groups at 200 from 1/28" or 6 to 7" from 1/48 at 200 yds.
I've made 2 kills on bucks at over 200, one at 221 and another at 248 with the 1/28". many bucks and bulls have been killed, by others than myself, with one shot and only one bullet has ever been recovered. This bullet doesn't look that much different from a Buffalo or Hornady bullet but performs much different. Anyway, all that to say, although what's been said is generally true, some heavy conicals may shoot well in 1/48" twist.
Deadeye

You have sight setting for these distances?

Dan

 

[DanChamberlain]

There comes a point of diminising returns. The true "heavies" were designed to carry farther and weren't needed to do the job on flesh and bone.

The heavier the projectile, the quicker you will burn out your nipple. But they are cheap.

Enjoy.

Dan

 

[Idaho Ron]

The heavier the car the sooner you will need to put on new tires.
At some point we all have to replace a nipple. Tht is just the nature of the sport. I replace the nipple when I see that it needs it. I don't count how many shots I shoot with it. If the load is accurate and I hit what I am aiming at I don't care if I get 1000 shots or 100. I put a new nipple on before I hunt make sure how it shoots and pack out the meat and pay the taxidermist. Ron