how out of round can a round ball be

[token tory]

& still be usable in a C&B revolver?

I ask because I may have found a good supply of both round ball & conical bullets for my .44 Rem.

I'm not expecting perfection here, just how much tolerance is unacceptable. These are cast as there is a sprue remainder, but my main concern is they seem a little too out of round ignoring the sprue.

 

[paulvallandigham]

As long as they are wide enough to scrape lead off on the mouth of the chambers, they can be used. Since the balls are self centering, for this purpose, the balls that would fail this test would have to be smaller than the throat diameter of the chamber.

I would be more concerned about greater variations in weight affecting group size, but at the close range that most revolvers are fired, even this is not that big a concern.

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

I've never fired a cast round ball through any of my revolvers. I buy Hornady's and that's all I shoot.

Given that you're using cast balls, I think Paul is correct, I'd worry more about the weight. Here's why: As I push down heavily on the loading lever to seat the soft lead balls, I believe that the chambers' walls "fill-up" with perfectly round lead. Especially with the Horse Pistols--my Walker and 3rd Model Dragoon. That would help explain why the holes in the targets look like they were shot with wad cutter rounds! Perfect circular holes "cut" right out of the paper targets. Other revolvers such as the '60 Army (where I don't use that much force to seat the balls) leave the traditional torn target holes. The weight will cause more of a variation in POI.

Having said all that, keep in mind that I need to shoot tight groups at 50 yards in going for my Distinguished Expert in ML Pistol. If you're just plinking at 20 yards, you'll have a lot less variation troubles, and some good, cheap fun! :thumbsup:

Dave

 

[Arrowhead]

Since how round a ball is depends on how round the chamber you load it in it would really have to lopsided to affect your accuracy since only the front and back would of the ball wouldn't be changed. Does that make sense? Swaged round on the sides that encounter the cylinder walls and still out of round on each end that didn't.

Swaged roundballs from Hornady and Speer aren't perfectly round either. I've measured both and they vary. I've never measured one that was perfectly round. I have never been able to tell a difference in accuracy between swaged roundballs and those I've cast.

 

[renovato]

I used to really sweat the cast vs swaged and out of round ball situation until I tested some for accuracy. As long as they weight the same, there can be some dimensional differences and still shoot accurately. It's when they have drastically different weights that it really effects your groups.

I'd say give them a try and see how they work for you. As long as they're shaving a fairly even ring as you seat them, they should shoot just fine.

 

[token tory]

Thanks for the replies folks.
My concern was with minimum diameter when measured. I was more concerned with the possibility of chain-fires than accuracy as a couple of the balls I tested came out less than cylinder diameter, by just a hair, in some measurements, but over in others. Now I use lubed under ball wads so I'm probably just being paranoid anyway. :youcrazy:

I haven't weighed them, so I'll try that next & see how close they are.

I'll try them out when I get to the range & report, these are really, really cheap (a nickle per) for store bought & I was being cautions. The same guy has conicals for the same price so I may get a few of them as well just to play with.

I think he makes them himself as you just rummage through a big tin containing a couple of thousand & pick as many as you want of what you want. I grabbed a buck's worth (20 balls) & will get a boatload more if they work well. :applause:

 

[poordevil]

I remember an article by Mike Nesbitt in Muzzleloader where he tested round balls with wrinkles and such against ones weighed and sorted. Shooting off hand at black powder ranges there was no real differance.

I would imagine however if one were shooting a very high stakes contest, then you might benifit by being extra picky.

I shoot my ugly cast balls for plinking and bunnies and save the better looking ones for hunting the big stuff.

P

 

[Zonie]

As long as the minimum ball diameter is larger than the chamber they will be safe to shoot.

If the balls are so out of round that they are smaller than the chamber somewhere they will leave a gap between the outside of the ball and the bore of the chamber. That is inviting trouble even with the chamber mouth full of grease.
A lot of that grease gets blown out of the chambers next to the one that is firing and that could open up a path for the flame to get past the ball and into the powder.

 

[Norinco]

As long as your rifling stabilizes the bullet, it doesn't matter.

 

[cowpoke1955]

Paul and Zonie are correct. I have shot nothing but .454 balls I cast myself in my .44 Rem, except for some Lee 200 grain conicals for the Remington. Cast balls shoot as good as anything else.

 

[brubincam]

-----revolver balls are reshaped when loading and firing-----

 

[token tory]

I figured I'd do a weight comparison with some "good" (read expensive) swaged .454 RB's from a "Nationally known vendor".
Here's the results.
The cast ones I can get for a nickel each pretty much look like I'm going to get a bunch of 'em before someone else does. Hech it'll cost me a nickel to cast them myself!

Anybody have an idea why the slight, but consistent weight difference?
The local balls are more silver in color, the swaged ones more gray, but both can be scratched with a fingernail.

I' will shoot the sample lot I purchased & if nothing looks "off" but a bucketful of them, problems not withstanding.

id# swaged cast
1 144.9 135.1
2 144.2 136.3
3 143.5 136.3
4 144.8 136.4
5 144.8 134.7
6 143.7 136.2
7 145.4 134.8
8 143.4 135.6
9 145.2 136.1
High 145.4 136.4
Low 143.4 134.7
Average 144.4 135.7
Std.Dev. 0.753325959 0.688799277
weight diff. 8.7 (swaged)
Std.Dev. 0.064526681 (cast)