Hypothetical question re: flintlock and Alliant Black MZ

[Herb]

Thanks, Scota. That is big news.

 

[Newtire]

Newtire: I bought the Ferrocerium rods from "Firesteel". They have several sizes and lengths. https://firesteel.com/

Thanx curator!

 

[Carbon 6]

Alliant says not to mix Black MZ with other powders.

https://www.alliantpowder.com/downloads/Black_MZ_Warnings.pdf

 

[Herb]

Alliant says not to mix Black MZ with other powders.

https://www.alliantpowder.com/downloads/Black_MZ_Warnings.pdf

Hodgdon says the same thing about Triple 7, do not mix powders. But if you call up "Triple 7" and read Hodgdon's loading data about Flintlock, they post to add 5 grains of FFFFg black powder down the bore before the main charge.

 

[Carbon 6]

Hodgdon says the same thing about Triple 7, do not mix powders. But if you call up "Triple 7" and read Hodgdon's loading data about Flintlock, they post to add 5 grains of FFFFg black powder down the bore before the main charge.

But what do they say about Black MZ ?

 

[Herb]

But what do they say about Black MZ ?

Nothing. That is not their product, it is Alliant. Discontinued. For information, I do not "mix" powders. I fill my measure with the Triple7 or BMZ with no shaking, then tap it to settle about 5 grains volume and add the black powder (4F, 3F or 2F) on top of that and dump it down the bore. The 5 grains is just inside the touch hole where the black powder priming charge hits it. You can see my thread on Powder Tests in a .45 Flintlock in this Shooting Accessories forum December 15, 2014. Or go to your browser and tap in Triple 7 and that thread comes up complete with photos of powder tests.

 

[SDSmlf]

Alliant says not to mix Black MZ with other powders.

And some guns have BLACK POWDER ONLY stamped on their barrels......

 

[Zonie]

Alliant says not to mix Black MZ with other powders.

https://www.alliantpowder.com/downloads/Black_MZ_Warnings.pdf

When they say that, their talking about stirring the powders together, mixing one into the other.
That is different than using the black powder as a "starter" in one layer, below the synthetic black powder.

 

[Herb]

And some guns have BLACK POWDER ONLY stamped on their barrels......

My barrels don't have anything stamped on them except my name as builder on the bottom flat.

 

[Carbon 6]

BMZ produces significantly less pressure than Pyrodex or Goex.

 

[Larry Pletcher]

At one time Black MZ made a product called “Flash”. It was called a priming powder. It was packaged in small tubes. I timed it as I have about all grades of BP. It was frightfully slow - roughly twice as slow as Goex cannon grade.
I gave some to a friend who shoots offhand at Friendship. He shot a practice target and gave it back. He wouldn’t use it on a record bull.
Regards,
Pletch

 

[Herb]

Zonie, thanks for the input.

 

[Griz44Mag]

I don't understand. If you have black powder available why do you use a synthetic for anything besides lawn fertilizer?

 

[Herb]

I don't understand. If you have black powder available why do you use a synthetic for anything besides lawn fertilizer?

I have not kept track of how many CASES of black powder I have shot since 1993, maybe 8 or 10. If 10, that is 250 pounds of Goex, Swiss, Olde Eynsford and GRRW black powder. Charges from 40 to 140 grains in .36, .40, .45, .50, .54 and .58 calibers. Say an average of 70 grains per charge. That would be about 25,000 shots, most of it chronographed and shot for accuracy from a benchrest. I EXPERIMENT with Pyrodex P and RS and Triple 7 3F and 2F and Alliant Black MZ to see how they perform, both in caplocks I make and flintlocks I made. People frequently ask on these forums how these powders perform, and they usually get prejudiced and ill-informed answers. Your comment about using them for lawn fertilizer is an example. I find out for myself, and then pass it on.

 

[Griz44Mag]

I have not kept track of how many CASES of black powder I have shot since 1993, maybe 8 or 10. If 10, that is 250 pounds of Goex, Swiss, Olde Eynsford and GRRW black powder. Charges from 40 to 140 grains in .36, .40, .45, .50, .54 and .58 calibers. Say an average of 70 grains per charge. That would be about 25,000 shots, most of it chronographed and shot for accuracy from a benchrest. I EXPERIMENT with Pyrodex P and RS and Triple 7 3F and 2F and Alliant Black MZ to see how they perform, both in caplocks I make and flintlocks I made. People frequently ask on these forums how these powders perform, and they usually get prejudiced and ill-informed answers. Your comment about using them for lawn fertilizer is an example. I find out for myself, and then pass it on.

Well Herb, you are absolutely correct about one thing:
I am prejudiced towards real powder.
On accusation #2 - I am NOT ill-informed. I have friends and family both that shoot synthetics.
On my comment - why? Well because of (See accusation #1)
We are all good here buddy, not slamming you or anyone else, just don't understand why anyone would shoot synthetics when they have real black available - see it's simple? If I were to ever run out of black powder, I would probably shoot synthetic too, but I don't because I don't have to...

 

[Carbon 6]

I EXPERIMENT with Pyrodex P and RS and Triple 7 3F and 2F and Alliant Black MZ to see how they perform, both in caplocks I make and flintlocks I made. People frequently ask on these forums how these powders perform, and they usually get prejudiced and ill-informed answers. Your comment about using them for lawn fertilizer is an example. I find out for myself, and then pass it on.

And, what was the best or your favorite performer ?
I've tested them myself, over a broader range of applications. Wonder how we compare ?

I like them all for specific applications, but only one in all applications.
That's real Black powder, the standard upon which all others are built.

 

[Herb]

And, what was the best or your favorite performer ?
I've tested them myself, over a broader range of applications. Wonder how we compare ?

I like them all for specific applications, but only one in all applications.
That's real Black powder, the standard upon which all others are built.

I liked T7 2F and the Alliant BMZ, though I never shot much of it. The T7 needs a really good patch and/or an overpowder wad. I never shoot these powders except in testing, but they can be entirely reliable and I would trust them to hunt with, even in a flintlock.

 

[toot]

I shoot all of the time with T-777, in all of my flint lock with 4-FG, for the pan and have never had a misfire or fail to go off. now that is a fact. it is claimed that it can be used in a flint lock as a barrel main charge. friends have even primed with it to see what the out come would be? it went bang. so figure it out.

 

[toot]

I have used BLACK-MZ, in my flintlocks with a 10 grain charge of 4FG. in gun be fore the main charge and had ignition every and all the time.

 

[toot]

I heard that the BLACK-MZ, factory in VA, caught fire and blew up some time back and that is why I cant find any for sale. any one heard that? and is there any to be had? every time on line and SEARCH for it, it comes up discontinued.