I have so much to learn!

[Stone]

I just bought my first flintlock and I realize I have a lot to learn!

It was actually refreshing to buy a gun and have to read how to use it! I have owned and shot so many guns I honestly believe I could pick up any gun in the world and be ready to shoot it in under a minute .....except a flintlock

I bought the Traditions Pa. Pellet and while I think that gun is a mess, I think it will suffice until I know more. I would really like as much advice as I can get about increasing the odds of ignition. I took it out and shot it a handful of times just to see what it was going to do. I had instant ignition, I had delayed ignition, I had no ignition.

After taking the gun apart and studying everything on it, I think I understand why I had the "no ignition" fires. I am going to use Pyrodex pellets for simplicity and the fact that there is a touch hole that goes sideways for 1/2 inch, makes a 90 degree turn, and goes another full inch before it reaches the pellets, I am amazed it ever fired.

From now on I will put a dose of FFFF in the barrel using my pan primer prior to inserting the pellets and bullet.

I also expect that there are tricks I will need to learn about positioning of the flint, the proper amount of pan powder, how much to tickle into the touch hole, etc., etc., etc.

I expect to hunt with it this weekend so any basic advice would be appreciated.

 

[pilot]

Find some Black Powder instead of the Pyrodex.

Do a search here for Pyrodex and flintlocks. Ton of stuff on why you don't want to go there.

 

[Stone]

Find some Black Powder instead of the Pyrodex.

Do a search here for Pyrodex and flintlocks. Ton of stuff on why you don't want to go there.

Thanks for the reply.

For now I will be trying Pyrodex, the gun is made to use it and thats what I have. I will try everything I can to make the pellets reliable.

 

[ronaldrothb49]

Flintlocks do not do well with substitute powders. Really don't do well with powder pellets. Given your set up with a counter bored breech plug you need lose powder in it to work best. Flintlocks work best with real black powder. The ignition temp of Pyrodex is approximately twice that of black powder.

 

[cynthialee]

if you put a small kicker charge of black powder (5-10 grains) in before the pyrodex it will make it so you can use the pyrodex (or pellets) in the flintlock
if you have a patent breach just enough black powder to fill it is sufficient

 

[Stone]

if you put a small kicker charge of black powder (5-10 grains) in before the pyrodex it will make it so you can use the pyrodex (or pellets) in the flintlock
if you have a patent breach just enough black powder to fill it is sufficient

Thanks

Thats exactly what I plan to do.

 

[Stone]

if you put a small kicker charge of black powder (5-10 grains) in before the pyrodex it will make it so you can use the pyrodex (or pellets) in the flintlock
if you have a patent breach just enough black powder to fill it is sufficient

Can you tell me what is meant by a patent breech?

 

[Brokennock]

Thanks for the reply.

For now I will be trying Pyrodex, the gun is made to use it and thats what I have. I will try everything I can to make the pellets reliable.

You are correct, to a degree.
"Pyrodex, the gun is made to use it..."
Yes, the gun is advertised as being designed to use pyrodex, and pellets at that. Lots of things are advertised as being designed to do things that they don't do well.
Think about the what the design is actually requiring the "flash" to do.
Basically it is asking the "flash" or heat and some flame to perform like a caplock, without the ignition charge being sealed at the source end. It must go through, "....touch hole that goes sideways for 1/2 inch, makes a 90 degree turn, and goes another full inch before it reaches the pellets....." Pellets that are even more difficult to ignite than loose pyrodex.
You're right, it is a miracle it ever works at all.

In reality, this gun was not designed to shoot anything. It was designed to increase sales. It was designed and marketed to take advantage of people wanting to hunt a special season that don't want to learn to deal with the issues and equipment that inspired that season. It is a marketing and sales product.

You're best bet, sell it for a GPR or other similar gun that at least has a flash hole direct to powder.
Second best, and I understand your desire to make this thing bend to your will and work,,, is the 4f "kicker" charge.

Best of luck.

 

[Stone]

You are correct, to a degree.
"Pyrodex, the gun is made to use it..."
Yes, the gun is advertised as being designed to use pyrodex, and pellets at that. Lots of things are advertised as being designed to do things that they don't do well.
Think about the what the design is actually requiring the "flash" to do.
Basically it is asking the "flash" or heat and some flame to perform like a caplock, without the ignition charge being sealed at the source end. It must go through, "....touch hole that goes sideways for 1/2 inch, makes a 90 degree turn, and goes another full inch before it reaches the pellets....." Pellets that are even more difficult to ignite than loose pyrodex.
You're right, it is a miracle it ever works at all.

In reality, this gun was not designed to shoot anything. It was designed to increase sales. It was designed and marketed to take advantage of people wanting to hunt a special season that don't want to learn to deal with the issues and equipment that inspired that season. It is a marketing and sales product.

You're best bet, sell it for a GPR or other similar gun that at least has a flash hole direct to powder.
Second best, and I understand your desire to make this thing bend to your will and work,,, is the 4f "kicker" charge.

Best of luck.

Thank you!

Extremely good info which I have taken to heart! I will hunt this season with this marketing toy and then make the switch.

 

[Brokennock]

I have a question for the "kicker" charge crowd. Just curiosity.
Does the sudden ignition and combustion of a faster burning "kicker" charge move the main charge and/or ball forward in the bore/chamber before the main charge ignites and does its job? I believe this phenomenon was the reasoning behind Elmer Keith's development of a cartridge load that purposely ignited the leading edge of the powder charge.

 

[Grenadier1758]

Thanks for the reply.

For now I will be trying Pyrodex, the gun is made to use it and thats what I have. I will try everything I can to make the pellets reliable.

In theory, your gun is designed to use Pyrodex pellets. In practice, the pellets don't work. Eventually you will switch to real black powder.

 

[ord sgt]

You have much to learn, Grasshopper. Flintlocks can be fun but they can also be frustrating. Taking the Pyrodex out of the equation and replacing it with black powder will reduce the frustration level. Duplex loads. Two different powders to do one job. Twice the cost when you only need one type of powder.

 

[Steve Martin]

Stone - you said you wanted advice from those of us that have been messing with flintlocks for quite some time. Trust us when we tell you that Flintlocks are meant for black powder. I love shooting (and working on) these guns but believe me, trying to use black powder substitutes just adds a BIG frustration factor to a type of gun that already has a pretty steep learning curve. While you may be able to make black powder subs work on occasion I think the hit or miss of ignition will finally cause you to buy a true flintlock as Brokennock suggested or you will end up just giving up on flintlocks altogether which would be a shame.

 

[cynthialee]

You have much to learn, Grasshopper. Flintlocks can be fun but they can also be frustrating. Taking the Pyrodex out of the equation and replacing it with black powder will reduce the frustration level. Duplex loads. Two different powders to do one job. Twice the cost when you only need one type of powder.

Indeed, but if you already have a can of pyrodex might as well use a duplex load to use up the stuff and not waste the money one already spent.

Also Black Powder can be hard to find in some places. A pound of BP will make for a lot of kicker charges for the easier to obtain pyrodex.

 

[hanshi]

Trying to get a flintlock to work reliably with Pyrodex is like trying to find an honest Politian; failure will dog your heels. If you MUST use that stuff get the loose powder and not the pellets. You won't get hunting reliability but you might end up with some level of success.

 

[PastorB]

Been shooting muzzleloaders since 1977, and I concur with all of the above opinions concerning the use of Pyrodex in a flintlock. It is just an exercise in frustration, and will never work with any level of reliability, despite what Traditions marketing department implies. I use a lot of Pyrodex (never pellets) in percussion guns, and I'm not a hater. However, when the flintlocks come out, real black powder is the only way to go.

 

[Stone]

Indeed, but if you already have a can of pyrodex might as well use a duplex load to use up the stuff and not waste the money one already spent.

Also Black Powder can be hard to find in some places. A pound of BP will make for a lot of kicker charges for the easier to obtain pyrodex.

I was planning on using Pyrodex Pellets because I have them and powder is simply not available right now.

After what I have read here, I am on a mission today to get a pound of Goex FFF, and will save the pellets for in-line hunting. My nephew gave me a couple ounces of Goex FFFF for pan priming.

Triple Seven is available but I read that this introduces yet another level of marketing double-talk.

 

[cynthialee]

777 I have never used it but I have read up on it and I would pass unless it was my only option
but if it was the only option I suspect I would be happy to have it

 

[PastorB]

Triple 7 is great in percussion guns, does exactly as advertised. Higher velocity, more shots per lb., way easier to clean. Using Goex or Swiss in my 1861 Springfield (original) I get 5 or 6 shots before ramming a minie becomes difficult, and a few more shots make it impossible without cleaning. Triple 777 I can fire without cleaning until I get tired of ramming. BUT, when I go hunting with my Springfield (or must any other gun), I load with real black to insure ignition. I have never had Triple 7 or even pyrodex fail to fire in a percussion gun, but don't want the first time for it to happen be when I'm getting my one and only shot at game. For sure use only real black in a flintlock at any time.

 

[M. De Land]

I just bought my first flintlock and I realize I have a lot to learn!

It was actually refreshing to buy a gun and have to read how to use it! I have owned and shot so many guns I honestly believe I could pick up any gun in the world and be ready to shoot it in under a minute .....except a flintlock

I bought the Traditions Pa. Pellet and while I think that gun is a mess, I think it will suffice until I know more. I would really like as much advice as I can get about increasing the odds of ignition. I took it out and shot it a handful of times just to see what it was going to do. I had instant ignition, I had delayed ignition, I had no ignition.

After taking the gun apart and studying everything on it, I think I understand why I had the "no ignition" fires. I am going to use Pyrodex pellets for simplicity and the fact that there is a touch hole that goes sideways for 1/2 inch, makes a 90 degree turn, and goes another full inch before it reaches the pellets, I am amazed it ever fired.

From now on I will put a dose of FFFF in the barrel using my pan primer prior to inserting the pellets and bullet.

I also expect that there are tricks I will need to learn about positioning of the flint, the proper amount of pan powder, how much to tickle into the touch hole, etc., etc., etc.

I expect to hunt with it this weekend so any basic advice would be appreciated.

Remember being 18-20 and thinking that every thing worth knowing you pretty much had figured out already? Here I am in my early 70s and am now saying " Why there ain't no end to the things I don't know yet" ! Perspective changes with age to a reasonable minded person.
I'm just getting started on new things to try to learn how to do in this world.