Lewis & Clark Expedition Rifle?

[tsmgguy]

Rumor has it that Lewis & Clark Expedition rifle #15 (of 15) has surfaced in Utah after 50 years in the hands of the same owner. If true, this would be one of the most significant recent historical finds. Can anyone furnish information about this rifle, particularly photos?

For many years, informed thinking had it that the Expedition carried M1792-94 Commission rifles, shortened and possibly bored to .54 caliber. More recent research would seem to suggest that the 300 Commission rifles avialable at the time were of generally poor quality, tended to fail proof tests, and so would have been unacceptable to Lewis for a trek possibly lasting for a period of years. As he left the Harper's Ferry arsenal, rifles in hand, before the adoption of the M1803, what was then in his possession? Predecessors of the M1803?

Any links to better information, particularly photos, will be much appreciated.

http://www.army.mil/cmh-pg/LC/The%20Mission/Facts/rifles.htm

 

[rabjr]

Just where is this rumor coming from anyway?

 

More recent research would seem to suggest that the 300 Commission rifles avialable at the time were of generally poor quality, tended to fail proof tests, and so would have been unacceptable to Lewis for a trek possibly lasting for a period of years.

Can you tell us what that more recent research is, who did it and where it was published? I've never read anything about these guns failing proofs in great numbers, and there are many 1792/4 guns that have survived to the present day with what appear to be original barrels. The best source I've seen in recent years on this issue is the 1999 Man at Arms article by Frank Tait. Very well researched and well cited. The web page you list has no citations for where their information comes from.

Sean

The Tait citation is:
Tait, Frank A. 1999. The US Contract Rifle: Pattern of 1792. Man at Arms. Issue no. 3. pg 33-45

 

[Johnny Tremain]

Utah, aint that the place where Joe Smith talked to Jesus?

 

[Desert Rat]

I think you're thinking of New York...no wait a minute that's where he found the magic golden plates that only he could read with special glasses. I'm not sure what went down in Utah except trying to run Ole Gabe out of the territory.

If the rifle really does exist it would be like finding the holy grail. I wonder how they would prove it was on the expedition? Maybe a bill of sale from the Corps upon their return?

 

[redwing]

Maybe they found it looking thru those special glasses? :wink:

 

[tsmgguy]

http://home.earthlink.net/~swier/LCfirearms.html

 

[tsmgguy]

http://thehunterslife.com/forums//showthread.php?t=2542

 

[rich pierce]

Link
Don Stith has researched the Lewis and Clark rifles and offers a great parts set.

 

Haven't Seen or read this book, but it appears he's on the 1792 side of the issue.

JA Hanson has a great quote in his Fur Trade Cutlery book. Speaking of the Western Fur Trade, he says:
"John F. Kenedy observed that the greatest enemy of the truth is often not the lie, but rather the myth. So it is with Hawken rifles, Green River knives, trade whiskey, and the Bowie."

I think you could add the L&C 1803 Harpers Ferry rifle to that list. Most of this thought seems to spring from a single uncited statement by Russell.

Sean

 

[RC]

""If true, this would be one of the most significant recent historical finds."" seems to me (IMHO) finding the original air rifle was most significant..that probably saved their lives more times than all the rifles they had.. :hmm: (IMHO!)

 

[TANSTAAFL]

Nope, may be wrong, but think Joseph Smith did that in Vermont. Joseph and his brother Hyrum were shot to death by a mob June, 1844, in the jail at Carthage Illinois.

Brigham Young was the leader whom in 1846 started the migration on the Mormon Pioneer trail into present day Utah. Some 70,000 Mormon's would have made the trek by the late 1860's.



Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats.
H.L. Mencken

 

[faw3]

finding the original air rifle was most significant..that probably saved their lives more times than all the rifles they had.. (IMHO!)
I thought someone like a airgun company owner or the Smihsonian had this one? Because I've seen a copy that was made of it while it was pulled apart on the web for cleaning ect next to I belive the org. Also with just the stuff you'll read sometimes.. I remember the M at A's story and a bunch of others, best guess I got out of the "OFFICAL WEB SITE" was it was the older rifle with the "new" 03 lock (and maybe the barrels got made for it also from pre production 03s)?? Who knows for sure, I got a feeling, NO Id bet on it that the Smithson has one.( Nothing that great for its time would of let the players and parts get away without saveing somethings). Just my 2 cents from reading waaay to much over the years. Fred :hatsoff:

 

[BrownBear]

Here is the story of finding the air rifle after all these years. A long, but good read.

 

[faw3]

Thanks for that site now I know my mind isnt all gone,now if someone from the Smithson will show us a mint rifle....... :hmm: Fred :hatsoff:

 

[SMOKETECH]

THE MAGAZINE WE PROCEEDED ON FROM THE LEWIS & CLARK TRAIL HERITAGE FOUNDATION HAS AN ARTICLE ABOUT THIS RIFLE

 

[runningbadger]

If ya all can read through the whole paper it does have a good description of the 1800 rifle. :hmm:

 

[JCW]

sounds like mushrooms and peyote played a part............. :blah:

 

[faw3]

The mag was in a stack I havent packed yet what are the ods right next to my bed, that was a hell of a Assault Rifle 20 46s in less than 60 seconds :shocked2: and a air rifle - with working cock to boot. :shake: Fred :hatsoff:

 

[RC]

if you ever want to shoot a truly uncomfortable gun...take a shot with the repro L&C air gun..! :shocked2: with the air tank as the butt..it don't exactly "fit" yer shoulder and cheek.. :rotf: but I hit the target! it is a truly amazing piece considering when it was made! gees, even without consider when..amazing!! wish I had one...... :grin: sure did impress the indians! :thumbsup: