Metis coat

[skunktop]

Looking to make a fitted style metis coat for the fur trade era. Any ideas on best patterns with shoulder fringe.

Also, I'm looking to buy brain tan hides, I don't have time to tan Myself. I see some on eBay but they say Commercial brain tan. What does this mean?

 

[KHickam]

Commercial brain tanned is not brain tanned - if you want real brain tan - get in touch with Oliver McCloskey - or you can get german tanned from Crazy Crow and either get the smoked hides or do it yourself - german tanned is very close to fish oil tanned which was a process that was used in the period

I have a few hides but not many I will sell when I get them done

 

[LaBonte]

There are several braintanners out there such as http://braintanner.com/, Don Born and Oliver McCloskey - who are advertisers in Muzzleloader Magazine, also Matt at www.braintan.com - I've used all of the above at times and can recommend their work
on all braintan pre-stretch it before cutting...

"Commercial" braintan is actually an imitation using liquid aldehydes (aldehydes in the smoke are what actually tan the hide) and/or fish oil....

For a proper pattern the best bet is to get one of the 1830's era frock coat patterns (the style is older than the 1830's) http://www.amazon.com/1830s-1840s-1850s-Frock-Pattern/dp/B002A9847K

you will have to add fringe where wanted...

if you'd like examples of originals let me know - I've got several images I can post...

 

[skunktop]

Thanks guys! Lot's of help in those posts. Also, I am about 5ft 8in, about 150lbs. How many square feet of hides should I look to by? 30-35? 35-40, 40-45?

 

[skunktop]

Also, on the German tan, while it is authentic to the period, how common would it have been for this method to be used west in the fur trade? Obviously native hides would probably be brain tanned, but if german tanning/fish oil tanning was something a european was brought up on, he may have tanned his own hides. Is there any documentation to confirm german/fish oil tanned hides were used in the era by the fur trappers?

 

[Sean Gadhar]

Frock Coat pattern Used for Metis Coats
http://www.braintan.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=1&Product_Code=LGFrock


Read 1st hope that helps

 

[skunktop]

Any idea on hide square footage?

 

[LaBonte]

I generally figure a minimum of 5 deer hides which are usually about 10 square feet - this allows room for the extras and nay mistakes.

As for the German tan - no historical mention for the RMFT 1820 and beyond that I know of. On the other hand the smoked GT once worn a bit is close to being indistinguishable from BT. So I reckon it all depends on how "correct" you want to be

 

[Rod Lassey]

I made my hide coat with 4 hides, but the layout was tight, to say the least. If you've got the hides, go with Labonté's suggestion and use 5 hides. I'm talking average mule deer sized hides, this'll be quite different if you're using elk.

Try to lay out like pieces in the same direction---if you're using two-piece sleeves, the pieces should run the same direction on the hide. Likewise the front panels should lay the same way on the hide as the rears, etc. Don't lay them out 90 degrees to each other, or they'll stretch in different directions.

Braintan is pretty stretchy and forgiving of minor mistakes, and I know the toughest thing to do is making that initial cut.

Rod

 

[LaBonte]

re: elk - While it is nice due to the size the weight can be a factor - it's about twice the thickness of deer and the weight can add up pretty quick...I've made many elk hide coats but for myself I prefer the thinner deer..

 

[skunktop]

Im considering ordering three 20-22sq ft Smoked German Tan hides from Crazy Crow, would this bee sufficient?

 

[LaBonte]

that should be plenty enough - again once you get them pre-stretch them

Their instructions say don't dampen with water, but I do it all the time with no problems - it makes them a bit stiffer at first but just working them will soften them back up. I stretch and let hang in the sun/wind for at least 48 hours when possible....if not pre-streched (or lined with cloth) you will eventually look like a kid you're wearing your Dad's coat... :hmm:
(personal experience!) plus you get about 10-15% "more" leather..

 

[skunktop]

Ok. So now my next question is what type of designs, such as beadwork, embroidery, and quill work would be appropriate, and on what parts on the jacket?

 

[Rod Lassey]

Robert Campbell coat:
http://www.urbanmuseumcollaborative.org/campbell/coat.shtml

Or, just use Google image:
https://www.google.com/search?q=me...eqyAGhxIDoBA&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAQ&biw=1280&bih=570

That should give you some ideas.

Rod

 

[skunktop]

That first link was a perfect example of what I'm looking for. Would it be a good idea to use pre-sewn authentic patterns from someone who pre-sews them onto cloth,and then stitching that onto the jacket or...?

I know I fer sure can't hand embroider.

 

[KHickam]

More than likely brain tan is the most authentic

 

[KHickam]

Chuck - Even with pre-stretching - and I worked it a bit - I hope it don't stretch too much more or I will have to re-do my frock - as I made it big enough to go over some heavy clothes and in the summer it will be "roomy"

 

[skunktop]

Yea I think I'm going to go with the German Tan for financial reasons though.

I don't have the time or the money or the location to tan my own hides, and the price is beyond me.

Anyone know a good place to buy pre-sewn Metis designs and bead/quillwork?

 

[Rod Lassey]

In general, most beading/quilling is done on the garment. There are very few sources for decent sew-on beadwork/quillwork. Stay away from loomed beading, most is imported stuff that really isn't appropriate. Less is more---it's better to have a little well done ornamentation, than a bunch of gaudy incorrect stuff. Lazy-stitch beading isn't terribly difficult, and a simple row of it along the shoulder-sleeve seam would add much. For an early look, try somewaht larger beads, 8/0 size or so. Smaller beads were used, but in general, the pound bead size would be more common---and easier to work with, at least for my fat fingers.

Here's a link to a catalog that has quite a bit of beading supplies:
http://www.crazycrow.com/

Rod

 

[skunktop]

Yea Im thinking a mix between this:http://www.urbanmuseumcollaborative.org/campbell/coat.shtml

With the beads along the seams as you said, and then this

http://www.awchimo.ca/html_alt/Culture/historical_metis_dress.html

With a little floral activity going on in the back.

Im just not sure I could do the stitching myself. Are there any good videos or sites to help guide this along? Im sure I can find something on youtube, but Im sure someone here has a resource.