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Muzzleloading myth busting
- Thread starter kyron4
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Trapper Scott
45 Cal.
I've watched several of his videos and always found him entertaining and willing to teach. As far as the differences between the F's, it makes sense to my brain.
I like his sense of humor and have learned a lot.
From an instructor perspective, I get why the stuff he calls "myths" is there. To go around and call it "myth" is a bit self serving here. While an experienced black powder shooter will find this entertaining, keep in mind that there are complete noobs out there that are learning their stuff from Utoob and not from experienced black powder enthusiasts. There's a reason the curricula is written the way it is and that is to stress safety above all else. The very material we teach from was written by the NMLRA in cooperation with the NRA and again, it's written from an abundance of safety for the novice black powder shooter. So keep that in mind when looking at this guy's 15 min of fame.
The only barrel ruptures I have knowledge of . One was two teenage kids using smokeless in a factory made T.C.. The barrel exploded on the 2nd shot. The shooter was killed, while the other one was injured. The survivor stated , that the powder they used , "looked black" , and they used the same powder measure Dad used. Also , it was stated they made the mistake of "sneaking" , Dads gun out , w/o permission or supervision.
The 2nd barrel rupture , was on a custom long rifle barrel , and was due to a ball being "short started" , right at a deeply dovetailed muzzle end , barrel pinning lug. Nobody was injured in this case.
Also , the video was good info , and cuts to the chase , with little BS.
The 2nd barrel rupture , was on a custom long rifle barrel , and was due to a ball being "short started" , right at a deeply dovetailed muzzle end , barrel pinning lug. Nobody was injured in this case.
Also , the video was good info , and cuts to the chase , with little BS.
Add a tight patch or heavy conical to the test.
CVA has a similar test video and the barrel ripped apart with a short started powerbelt at the muzzle.
Anything can happen when you're reloading. Muzzleloader, centerfire, etc.
CVA has a similar test video and the barrel ripped apart with a short started powerbelt at the muzzle.
Anything can happen when you're reloading. Muzzleloader, centerfire, etc.
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I think the therory comes from modern gun bursting due to mud,dirt or some other obstruction in the barrel? Smokeless powder produces high CUPS and could blow a barrel apart! Black powderis a different animal.
Buffalo Bones
32 Cal.
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Several years ago I was given a can of powder. The guy said it made his gun kick very hard when he shot a couple of times. It turned out to be smokeless shotgun powder!!! He was lucky that the gun held together.
I know of an accident involving an original '61 Springfield. Guy had gotten a bunch of stuff from an estate sale. Seems the folks putting together the package just poured all the powder into a "black" powder can. Hey it's all black, what's the problem. Turns out, they mixed a bunch of smokeless into the real BP and it destroyed an original musket as a result. Fortunately the shooter was unharmed but the gun was a complete loss.
The one that gets me is the so called "fuse" effect and banking the prime away from the touch hole to prevent this. The extensive testing by Larry Pletch dispelled this myth. I use white lightning liners in all my rifles and fowlers, with the main charge about 1/16" away from the pan this makes for a very short fuse.
Johnny Tremain
Silversmith in training
What he is referring to about full cases, only apply to 45-70 they 45-120.
Even with smokeless we still fill the cases.
Ive found it adds accuracy to 45ACP & 38 Special.
So I fill all my straight wall cases.
Even with smokeless we still fill the cases.
Ive found it adds accuracy to 45ACP & 38 Special.
So I fill all my straight wall cases.
I was thinking that maybe a full charge of BP with the bullet short started needs to be tested. 110 to 120 grains of BP like many folks use for deer hunting etc. that might make for a difference then for the air gap.
But way back then when they used Damascus barrels and wrought iron such things as a air gap could be really dangerous. I was looking at my old circa 1871 Thuer conversion .44 Colt revolver and those cylinders look way too thin to me. Especially on the outer edge. I would never attempt to fire it because of that. Then of course most of us remember reading how guys blew up their Colt Walker first version revolvers way back then too.
But I can agree in that I believe that no one really has come forth with a first hand account of a shooter blowing up their black powder gun with a air gap between the bullet and BP charge. But we all have seen blown up guns before though.
But way back then when they used Damascus barrels and wrought iron such things as a air gap could be really dangerous. I was looking at my old circa 1871 Thuer conversion .44 Colt revolver and those cylinders look way too thin to me. Especially on the outer edge. I would never attempt to fire it because of that. Then of course most of us remember reading how guys blew up their Colt Walker first version revolvers way back then too.
But I can agree in that I believe that no one really has come forth with a first hand account of a shooter blowing up their black powder gun with a air gap between the bullet and BP charge. But we all have seen blown up guns before though.
longcruise
70 Cal.
He didn't comment on the size of the charge in his short started shot but it was clearly very light.
Johnny Tremain
Silversmith in training
I just watched another of his videos. He weighed his powder with a scale not by volume.
When someone mentioned rupturing a case, he dismissed it as a bad case.
Not filling the case ONLY cases hang fires. Well then how did a weak case rupture.
When someone mentioned rupturing a case, he dismissed it as a bad case.
Not filling the case ONLY cases hang fires. Well then how did a weak case rupture.
And? Black powder no matter 1, 2, 3 or 4fg can be measured grain for grain. 100gr volume black powder ( not subs ) should weigh 100gr on the scale.
I conducted an experiment 20 years ago that confirms @Frontier's assertion. I measured 100 grain volume charges of GOEX black powder and weighed the volume charges on a balance scale. Based on the lots I measured, there was only a 1 grain weight difference between the 2Fg and the 3Fg powders. Somewhat surprising to me was that the 2Fg powder was heavier than the 3Fg powder. This was true for 5 different brands of volume measures. I guess that the lot of 2Fg had a higher density that the 3Fg.
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I have had close personal experience of a barrel failure , about 6 feet; I was Range Officer and standing just left of the first shooter on the line.
He fired and there was a detonation and the back of his barrel split and the plug threads were visible.
His rifle was a three band Enfield in very nice condition (up till then!) and he’d loaded it with a “black” smokeless powder from a recommended black powder volume measure.
No injuries, other than to nerves.
The powder had been sold to him by a reputable gun shop as black powder.
He fired and there was a detonation and the back of his barrel split and the plug threads were visible.
His rifle was a three band Enfield in very nice condition (up till then!) and he’d loaded it with a “black” smokeless powder from a recommended black powder volume measure.
No injuries, other than to nerves.
The powder had been sold to him by a reputable gun shop as black powder.
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This is why I don't buy open cans of anything at gun shows
An old metal can of Goex with most of it still in there? Nope
An old metal can of Goex with most of it still in there? Nope
Antiques and reproductions aside...I would think that you could fill the whole barrel with black powder and be fine. It just doesn't build enough pressure to hurt anything. To my understanding, black powder reaches a certain pressure plateau and builds no more. Unlike smokeless powder. I get a kick out of his videos and has good instructions on how to make your own.
