Needed: 1-gr. Increment Adjustable Powder Measure

[FSCGunslinger]

Anybody know where I can get one? I see all kinds of 5-gr. adjustable ones, but have yet to find a 1-gr. adjustable one. I figure being able to adjust my powder measure by 1-gr. increments will allow me to achieve best results with my pistol.

 

[musketman]

5 grain increments was the smallest I have ever seen, you may have to custom make one and then calibrate it with a powder scale...

You can make non-adjustable ones in one grain increments using .44 magnum or .45 long colt brass, plugging the primer pocket with epoxy...

Weigh up your charge on a powder scale, dump in the charge and mark the level, dump out the charge and trim the brass to the mark...

Then stamp or engrave the charge size on the outside of the case, you can even fit them on a key-ring using a "eye" extending from the priming pocket of the case...

 

[Stumpkiller]

I have one that I believe came from Dixie Gun Works that is marked in 5 gr increments but is infinately adjustable. Sadly, the markings are off by about 20%! I marked one side of the slide where it sticks out with a carbide pencil so I have accurate volumes.

My two T/C factory made measures read close to what actually weighing the powder produces (96% to 98% accurate). The one from Dixie, and another marked only "Italy" are 78% and 85% accurate, respectively. That's kind of scary as someone deliberately loading hot and thinking he's loading 120 gr is actually throwing 146 gr! Yowzer!

The other fly in the ointment is that you probably won't be able to accurately dip or dispense 1 gr. increments into a measure. With the kernel size, compression and leveling errors it will probably be +/- 1 gr. dispensing error. (Unless you take to dipping and carding each throw).

You'd need to scale-measure consistant, say, 18 gr. vs. 19 gr. charges.

 

[mglampson]

While smokeless powder adjustment to the tenth of a grain can have an effect on performance, it was my understanding that Black powder was WAY more forgiving. Being that it is ment to be measured by volume, it would be very unlikely under normal conditions to even pour to within a grain or two. Didn't think you could see much of a change less you varied by around 5 grain, thus the 5 grain increments on the measures.

Britches

 

[jtmattison]

While smokeless powder adjustment to the tenth of a grain can have an effect on performance, it was my understanding that Black powder was WAY more forgiving. Being that it is ment to be measured by volume, it would be very unlikely under normal conditions to even pour to within a grain or two. Didn't think you could see much of a change less you varied by around 5 grain, thus the 5 grain increments on the measures.

Britches

I agree with Britches.
Black powder being as "inefficient" as it is, I don't think you will see a difference in a grain or two.
Some folks say they use exactly 82 grains of 2f powder (just an example) but I don't see where there would be a difference in 82 grains or 86 grains.
I think five grain increments for a measure is good enough.
:m2c:

Huntin

 

[Stumpkiller]

Some folks say they use exactly 82 grains of 2f powder (just an example) but I don't see where there would be a difference in 82 grains or 86 grains

Yep. I have a 3 dram measure (each dram is 27.343 grains) that's equal to 82 grains. A second one made from turkey bone that I often use averages 84 gr. (With any new measure I dump out 10 charges and weigh them, then divide the result by 10). that means some at 82 and some at 86, but on the whole somewhere between.

A dram used to be the basic unit for measuring powder. Modern shotshells are still listed in "drams equivalent". 2-3/4 drams = 75 grains, 3-1/2 drams = 95.7 grains.

Using the quarter fractional dram scale, you find 6.8375 grains is the increment. That's probably as fine a change as anyone ever bothered worrying about except in long-range competition.

I've heard that the beginning charge was determined by putting a ball in your palm and pouring powder on it until it was covered up. That was the amount you then whittled out your measure to throw, unless your smith included a tin measure, as many did, to give you a jump on what his young, sharp-eyed assistant/servant zeroed the sights with.

:relax: We're doing this for fun, remember?

 

[silverfox]

Okay guys the question was 1 gr measure. I agree on the 5 gr. is close enough for rifle and shotguns for most. But Gunslinger is asking this for pistol. I see 5 gr in 80 to a 100 isn't much but 5 gr in 12 to 30 is a big difference. So for use in a pistol lets let Gunslinger work with his 1 or 2 gr difference if he can get it that close. Gunslinger don't know where you can get the measure you are looking for I would get one of the pistol measures and scribe lines on it after careful measurement with a scale I trusted. This should work. Good luck.
Fox :thumbsup:

 

[hairsmith]

The problem is that trying to measure 1 gr increments by volume is next to impossible.
With black powder it must be weighed to be that accurate.

How it is dipped how it is compressed in what ever you are measuring it all make a BIG deference. Try dipping one time, and then drop the same volume through a drop tube.... BIG deference in volume.

I have never herd of 1Gr making any deference in any BP gun I have ever bin around. From my 31cal revolver to my 577/450 BP express. In fact my Old Army 45 cant tell the differenced in 5Gr. of 3F.

Bullet weight makes more difference buy weight than black powder. :imo: :results:

Hairsmith

 

[WV_Hillbilly]

Anybody know where I can get one? I see all kinds of 5-gr. adjustable ones, but have yet to find a 1-gr. adjustable one. I figure being able to adjust my powder measure by 1-gr. increments will allow me to achieve best results with my pistol.

While it is true that you won't see a difference in a 22gr load versus a 21gr load... you probably could see a difference if you had a 3gr difference in a .31 or .36 cal pistol. I can understand your wanting the best accuracy possible from your pistol.

Most everyone who replied has stated that there is NO powder measure that is graduated in 1gr increments.
I have to DISAGREE with that... there actually was one that was made by CVA a while back...

CVA used to make a 0-30gr pistol powder measure that had 5gr (major) increments marked AND also had minor 1gr hash marks in between.

I found it to be as accurate as any other method of trying to measure things down to single grain increments--especially if you're doing some load development and comparison.

You will end up weighing the charge once you find the "sweet spot", and then after you determine that "special load", you'll also want to make a fixed powder measure from a spent brass cartridge case or brass (or aluminium) tubing.

Sorry I don't have any clue as to where you might find one of those CVA measures at this time. CVA has dropped all the sidelock guns and just about every accessory that went with them.

If I come across one at a gun show or whatever, I'll snag it for you and send it your way.

Shoot Safely!
WV_Hillbilly

 

[horkeye]

But Gunslinger is asking this for pistol. <SNIP> So for use in a pistol lets let Gunslinger work with his 1 or 2 gr difference if he can get it that close.

:agree:

weighing the powder in this instance is the only way to go, especially if working up target loads.

:imo: :results:

:redthumb:

 

[shmrck1]

Gunslinger,
it's seems to me that if Stumpkiller is
correct that measures are off 5 to 10% ( and i'm sure he
is) then at 25 or 30grns the difference would surely
not make that much of a difference. but if you insist
on being within 1grn then weighing is the only way to
go :imo:.
good luck in your pursuit
snake-eyes :thumbsup:

 

[FSCGunslinger]

A 3-gr. would probably be ok if anyone knows where I could get one of those. Only reason I asked for a 1-gr. one is because Gatofeo said he had one and used it to get good results. Thanks for the offer of sending me one if you find one. That'd be awesome. I'll post more later, but gotta get back to work now. Thanks again.

 

Trying to measure BP down to one grain increments is a bit of wasted effort. Variations is everyday life, like how fast you pour the powder, will make more than one grain difference from charge to charge.

There will be more than one grain difference if I fill a measure and them hand it to you and have you fill it.

Reloading modern cartridges we used to use powder dumps with long drop tubes and develop a specific technique of using the measure to insure charge uniformity. Even with modern gear the charge would vary 2-3 tenths of a grain if we were not careful.

If we were using the extruded stick powders we would not use the dumps due to shearing the grains and changing burn rates.

After you get your charge down to the one grain perfection I hope the humidity never varries or the tempature never changes. Lord help you when you change from one powder can to another! Do you have a scale along so you can measure the preasure you are placing on the rammer?

And what brand machine rest are you using in order to establish these one grain variables in group size and placement?

After thirty years of competition pistol shooting, I will guarentee that you cannot hold tha pistol steady enough with your hands to see a measureable difference in a one grain change in the load.

This belief that you will suddenly hit the perfect load and all the shots will miraculiously go into one hole are a bit of a fable. Its used more as an excuse for bad shooting habits providing blown groups due to "Not having the right load" than anything else. It is an excuse, not a reason.

It is your consistancy from load to load and shot to shot that will put the holes close together almost anywhere in that big area we refer to as a "moderate charge".

 

[Tahquamenon]

I had one of these stolen some time ago. They are an excellent single grain measure.

BELDING & MULL Powder Measure MICROMETER

Here is one listed on ebay right now:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=31825&item=7146802266&rd=1

Or,

You could go with weighing your charges which would be very accurate to the grain or fractions of a grain. A small electronic scale would do the trick. Once you have your optimal load achived, you can pre-weigh/measure out several small speedloaders worth of charges. Or make of buy a fixed measure in your desired grain/weight amount of charge.

Lyman 1000 XP Electronic Reloading Scale
Ideal for the range or table top. The new 1000 XP is accurate to 1/10 grain for the full range of its 1000 grain capacity. Slick new user friendly design has clear "snap lock" platform cover which rotates to full lay down position or may be removed. Scale works on 9V battery or with AC adapter. Calibration weight, powder pan and AC adapter included.
Item #7750750
1000XP Precision Elite Electronic Scale 110V
$139.95


Or, this is a very nice powder measure that will account for fractions of a grain. Once you have your load, then measure out several small speed loaders.

http://www.lymanproducts.com/lymanproducts/index.htm

55 Classic Black Powder Measure

Lyman has redesigned the 55 Powder Measure for both smokeless and black powder. A must for black powder cartridge silhouette and cowboy action shooters. The internal metering bars rotate in a non-sparking brass sleeve. A large non-static aluminum powder reservoir holds a pound of black powder. The unique three-slide adjustment bars are the key to consistent accuracy from small pistol charges to the largest rifle charges with accuracy to a fraction of a grain. Mounts on the bench or directly on a press or powder measure stand and includes a 7/8 x 14 adapter. Model without drop tubes also available.

Item #7767775 with 24" drop tube
55 Black Powder Measure, With Tubes $137.50

Item #7767760 without drop tube
55 Black Powder Measure, No Tubes $120.00

I would think that the precise hand measure would do the trick or if you really want the knat's keester, either the Lyman scale or the measure would work just fine.

:thumbsup:
:m2c:

 

[musketman]

This one can be set between the 5 grain increments...

Hayes Associates <-- click here