Obtaining accuracy

[Charlie_X]

I know that muskets and accuracy usually aren't two words that go together. I also know that there are a lot of explanations for this fact, such as the use of undersized lead balls and the poor aerodynamics of the delivery.

But in today's era of lubricated patches for softening powder fouling to a manageable level is it possible to get more accuracy? With a combination of patch and ball to provide a snug fit in the barrel can one expect better results with hitting a target downrange?

 

[jethro224]

Short answer; Yes.

Longer answer; With plenty of practice and range time spent to work up a load, a musket is capable of better accuracy than a lot of folks give them credit for. Depends on what exactly your definition of accuracy is and how good a shooter you are tho.

 

[Grenadier1758]

And you don't have to use the undersized ball unless you have to stick by strict historical requirements.

 

[Stumpkiller]

I know that muskets and accuracy usually aren't two words that go together.

Google up the Miquelet or the Maximillian Matches fired in the Olympics with muskets (repro & original). These guys are getting in the 90's (Miquelet) and 80's (Maximillian) out of a possible 100 at both 50 and 100 meters!

 

[Mike Brooks]

I know that muskets and accuracy usually aren't two words that go together. I also know that there are a lot of explanations for this fact, such as the use of undersized lead balls and the poor aerodynamics of the delivery.

But in today's era of lubricated patches for softening powder fouling to a manageable level is it possible to get more accuracy? With a combination of patch and ball to provide a snug fit in the barrel can one expect better results with hitting a target downrange?

Yep.

 

[rafterob]

All's I know is that one of our club's smoothbore shooters consistantly out shoots the rifles.

 

[Deadeye]

Short answer; Yes.

With plenty of practice a musket is capable of better accuracy than a lot of folks give them credit for. Depends on what exactly your definition of accuracy is and how good a shooter you are

Yep!
Deadeye

 

[damron]

what is average accuracy for 5 shots with a good smooth bore at 50 yards?

George

 

[piteruu]

One picture is better than a thousand words...
But first a few words:
- replica of Spanish infantry musket 1757( Ardesa .72 caliber, 44" barrel, no rear sight)
- 27 paper military style cartridges (108 garains of 2f BP, prime 2f BP, .69 ball, no grease)
- fast military shooting - 3 rounds per minute (in practice no less than 5 per 2 minutes)
- really bad weather (rain/wet snow, a few misfires, a few big delays)
- distance 50 meters
- diameter of black circle is 20 cm



Now the same musket but:
- 77 grains of 2f BP
- .022" patch (wet 1/6 ballistol/water)
- .69 ball
- 4f prime
- distance 50 meters
- 13 rounds, carefully aimed, ofhand
- diameter of black circle is 20 cm


Stumpkiller - Maximillian is 100m MLAIC competition for flintlock rifles. The target is as above (20cm black). Miquelet is 50m MLAIC competition for smoothbore military style flintlocks. The target is greater (40cm black) something like this:

We shoot 13 rounds but count 10 best. In the target above is only 12 holes (and the diameter of black is 42cm). Musket and loads as above.

 

[damron]

Thanks that's what i was curious about.

George

 

[Dphar]

what is average accuracy for 5 shots with a good smooth bore at 50 yards?

George

4-5"
Sometimes it takes a pretty heavy charge of powder to get this level of accuracy.
If accuracy is important then you need a barrel with rifling.

Dan

 

[Loyalist Dave]

The British designated marksman of the 19th century, armed with a standard King's Musket was expected to hit a man sized target (2' x 6') at 90 yards, five of six shots, two days in a row. Now that's not hunting accuracy for any hit on the "boards" was considered a hit, but considering that most folks will tell you that standard ammunition of the period probably wouldn't hit that target from that type of musket once out of six shots at 90 yards, that's not bad.

LD

 

[hanshi]

50 yards, 10 shots with two flyers (green holes) and a group of 8. Other holes from previous days.

I am perfectly satisfied with 5" to 6" groups at 50 yards. If better is needed use a rifle.

 

[CoyoteJoe]

""I am perfectly satisfied with 5" to 6" groups at 50 yards. If better is needed use a rifle.""

I agree! It must not be forgotten that in the hunting fields you can't discount "flyers", all shots count. While we all like to see good groups the real purpose of shooting groups on paper is to determine what is the worst our gun and load will ever do because the worst shot it ever throws is the best you can absolutely count on.

 

[damron]

what is average accuracy for 5 shots with a good smooth bore at 50 yards?

George

4-5"
Sometimes it takes a pretty heavy charge of powder to get this level of accuracy.
If accuracy is important then you need a barrel with rifling.



Dan

I have also had to shoot 90g in my 12ga capper and 2" at 25 is about what i get for 5 and 50 yards is 6" or so.I'm not too far off then.That's accurate enough for me for the ranges i would use it for.

 

[damron]

After playing with too big balls and tight patches and wads etc.. i went simple.I used a .690 ball with .015 ticking(spit on) with 55g of FF Goex.It loads supe easy and i shot 30 in the session and accuracy stayed good.Accuracy while not as good as i hear some shoot was pretty consistent.I have a slight bit of patch cutting (1/4" slice maybe) but it seemed no bid deal.Gun is a TC New Englander capgun with cyl bore barrel.

last two 5 shot groups at 25 were 2-1/4" with one group 4 of 5 were into about 1.25"Worst group was 3.25" and at 50 yards i shot one5 shot groups that had 4 into 6" and where #5 went i don't know!!(work to do there)

Should i be happy or should i expect better?

 

[Dphar]

what is average accuracy for 5 shots with a good smooth bore at 50 yards?

George

4-5"
Sometimes it takes a pretty heavy charge of powder to get this level of accuracy.
If accuracy is important then you need a barrel with rifling.



Dan

I have also had to shoot 90g in my 12ga capper and 2" at 25 is about what i get for 5 and 50 yards is 6" or so.I'm not too far off then.That's accurate enough for me for the ranges i would use it for.

The 50 caliber smooth rifle barrel shot best with 480 ball, ticking patch and 110 gr of ff GOI.
At 25 yards a FL pistol will out shoot it with 495 ball, thinner patch, 75 gr of fff Swiss. The load for the rifled barrel.
The current owner is having it straight rifled for more testing.
Smooth bores can be surprisingly accurate. But they always through fliers and this makes them problematical for hunting.
Dan

 

[damron]

oops!

 

[hanshi]

I've had rifles that shot just fine and yet cut patches. I don't suppose a smoothbore would be any different. IMO 5" to 6" at 50 yards is fine and dandy.