Pedersoli rifle

[dmboct19]

I recently bought a .54 Pedersoli Jaeger flintlock, beautiful gun. I'm wondering if anyone else has this rifle and shoots maxi-balls through it? I would like to know if anyone has a source for a maxi for it, the bore is tight and most traditional maxis won't fit I'm told. Any help? Thanks

 

[dckcrk]

I have several guns with odd size bores. I cast the next size up it it's not to far off and have a custom resize die made by Lee. $35.00 for any size up to .575.
I have them in .382 and .468 and both were at my door in less than 10 days. Because of the dual diameter nature of the maxi-balls I don't think this would work too well. I would go with the Lee improved minie and size it down to whatever I need after I pan lubed it. A poor mans version of this that I use on the Lee minie is to drill/lap out a piece of red oak to the size I want and push the bullet through with a short starter. It works well for the limited number of bullets I use as long as they are soft lead.

 

[cowrustler]

I've got one of those Jaegers and it is a nice rifle. Hunted our deer season with it but never got the shot I wanted.
Mine shoots very well with the Lee REAL bullet which is a good hunting bullet as well.
Round balls are ok at reduced loads but the REAL bullet is a winner.

 

[Jean-Luc]

Pedersoli sells a .540 Maxi Ball bullet mould for the Jeager Rifle.

 

[dmboct19]

I had seen that in their catalog but was hoping to buy them online, I don't have a good spot to cast bullets where I live.

 

I would try and develop a round ball load before you mess with bullets that won't perform any better than the round ball. .530 round ball, .018 patch, well lubed, say olive oil since it's an Italian copy of a German gun. 75 - 80 grains of fffg powder, then go from there up or down, and get loads for 25, 50, 100 yards. The sooner you separate modern guns, and ballistics from real muzzleloaders the better of you will be. The trick is to keep it simple, powder, patch, ball and lube.

Bill

 

[Jean-Luc]

That's right but the Pedersoli Jeager comes with two different .54 barrels. One has a slow 1:65 twist but the other-by far the most common-has a 1:24 twist.
The 1:65 is a wonderful round ball shooter while the 1:24 will shoot round balls over light loads only.

The 1:24 is of course historicaly out of place in a Jeager but if it is what he's got he will need the maxi.

 

[cowrustler]

Actually, according to John Bivens, Lyman Muzzleloaders Handbook, the 1/24 twist is right on historically for a Jaeger.

 

[tg]

Often guns of the ML era were faster twists than we would think but I believe they were also deeper grooves which probably made the difference as the PRB was the most common projectile, and there was nothing comparble to the modern design bullets used today, with the exception of the minnie ball in the 1850 and later period and it was a military round for the .58 cal if I recall, there was not a time during the flintlock period and early caplock period that a wide range of types and calibers of bullets were around.many of todays guns are made to shoot the modern bullets which to some is a deviation from the "spirit" of the sport.The guns of the past with short barrels and deep groves probably shot the ball well as today with pistols we have faster twists in the short barrels so the barrel length is important.

 

[dmboct19]

I appreciate all the info guys, thanks!My gun has the 1 in 24 twist, land to land measurement is .540 and groove to groove is .552, thats why I was thinking a maxi would be a better choice, any load data greatly appreciated and any idea of bullets in that range and who might sell them would be great!

 

[Zonie]

I may be wrong but I have read that many of the old guns used a twist that was one full turn in the length of the barrel.

That would explain perhaps why some of the original Jaegers had twists like a 1:24 or 1:28.

 

[cowrustler]

Elk, I am not employed by Lee but the REAL bullets are what you are looking for. I don't know if they are available commercially but you can buy a mold for about $20 plus shipping if you have any friends that cast bullets.
I had quite a selection of various .54 maxis and minis in my cupboard and they were all too big to load into my Jaeger. I wouldn't buy any just because they are available.
The pure lead REAL bullet loads easily. I think the one I have is around 300 grains. I shoot 80grains of 3f behind it. It is both accurate and I suspect potent in my Jaeger.
If you just want to plink, .530 round balls and 50-60 grains of powder will ring a gong or pierce a paper target nicely.

 

[Jean-Luc]

Actually the Jeager rifles are the first rifles ever devised. Rifling was invented in the German Alps for mountain hunting in an area where crossbow hunting was the most common way to bag game during the late middle age.
Early Gun makers had not a clue about the reasons why a rifled barrel would be more accurate than a smoothbore. One of the funniest explanations was that the devil was used to veer the balls but couldn’t catch the spinning balls. Without theoretical knowledge just everything was tried out and some Jeagers had even straight rifling.
European Jeagers were not devised for patched balls. The balls were forced into very deep grooves with a mallet. Loaded that way the ball couldn’t jump the rifling and just any rate of twist was possible. Easy reloading of the rifle was not an issue since mountain hunters never shot a second time on elusive game. Barrels had also to be short because a cumbersome gun would have been a serious hindrance while climbing the steep slopes of the Alps. Light short single shot rifles are still popular in the German Alps.
During the 1700th, the Jeager became more and more popular out of its original area and was even used by military units, usually called jeagers. Swiss militia became interested in using rifles to shoot at long range at enemies trying to invade their homeland. Only then, easy loading of the Jeager became a problem gun makers tried to solve. New grooves were invented and patches started to be used.
I own an original Swiss rifle made around 1760. It has a large number of grooves and very narrow lands, a slight blow of a small mallet is enough to force the ball in the barrel but the rate of twist is accordingly slow.
The German immigrants and gun makers who went to the American colonies introduced the Jeager in the New World. Some of those Jeagers were of the old style with deep grooves and fast twists but weren’t adapted to what colonist needed in their new environment. Easy and fast reloading was necessary even at the cost of lesser accuracy making the older Jeagers obsolete.

Due to the long history of Jeagers and the many types of rifling tested over time, just any type of rifling is historically correct but it is the shallow groove slow twist version that became popular in America because it was the answer to the challenges of life in America.

 

[dmboct19]

Do you think thr real bullet will fit, in .54 its a .557 diameter and the bore of mine is .540 land to land and .552 groove to groove, if it would fit that would be great. I was hoping another reader would have this rifle and know what works, I'd hate to get set up in casting and find out it won't fit, like I said I don't really have a good spot to cast, thanks for all the input so far!

 

[cowrustler]

Elk, this is the exact rifle I have and the REAL bullets fit fine. None of my other maxis came close.
I got mine from Dixie on sale last summer as the quick twist, .54 caliber, sling, reasonably short barrel, etc, fit what I wanted in a hunting rifle for mule deer.
My custom guns get to go to range here at the ranch; the Pedersoli Jaeger goes up the side of the mountain. And it also goes to the range because it's a fun rifle to shoot. You'll find it a nice shooting rifle with a dependable lock.

 

[dmboct19]

Thanks for the info, thats reassuring, if it works for you it should work for me! I want to use this on whitetail and possibly elk also, thanks again, much appreciated!

 

[tg]

I am somewhat familiar with the early rifleing and German guns, the first rifleing was straight and was used to collect fouling, still I have read of the one twist per rifle length that Zonie mentioned, again the grooves were deeper than what many guns made for shooting either modern bullets or PRB, I would suspect that by the 2nd quarter of the 18th century at the latest it was clear that the original patchless ball was not the best thing going with rifles,there are also a lot of German guns with longer barrels that still exist from reports from some on this forum with strong ties to Germany, not much of this really applies to the gun in question as it is made to look a bit like an 18th century German hunting gun but made to shoot 20th century designed hollow based bullets

 

[Jean-Luc]

You are right about the Pedersoli Jeager, it is a poor replica of the historic Jeager and the rifling is intended for modern maxi ball shooting. Pedersoli had hunters in mind when they devised that rifle.
Pedersoli has also introduced a target Jeager that looks a little bit better and has a 1:65 twist .54 caliber barrel well suited for patched round balls.

 

[tg]

Do these have the plastic nosecap? I think at one time they did.

 

[Jean-Luc]

The target has a brass nosecap but the regular jeager has a plastic nosecap