Pietta 1851 round balls or conicals ?

[kyron4]

Got a steel framed 36 caliber Pietta 1851 on the way and I'm looking at Lee moulds. For those who have fired both in that gun which do you prefer ? Are Lee 130 gr. conicals less accurate than balls ? Do I want the .375" balls or the .380" balls ? Anything else I should be aware of ? -Thanks

 

[nick_1]

Never shot a 36 conicals but after switching to conicals with my.44s I wouldn't go back. It's period correct and way more powerful.

 

[justinoldguy]

Got a steel framed 36 caliber Pietta 1851 on the way and I'm looking at Lee moulds. For those who have fired both in that gun which do you prefer ? Are Lee 130 gr. conicals less accurate than balls ? Do I want the .375" balls or the .380" balls ? Anything else I should be aware of ? -Thanks

I shoot a lot of .36 Navies, having several 1851's of both the Pietta and Uberti variety. Owning a bunch of cap and ball revolvers, from pocket models to the Walker, I will state without hesitation that the .36 Navies are my favorite for just messing around and plinking. My guns shoot best with round balls, .375 for Pietta's, and .380 for Uberti's. Conicals are not a bad option, I've shot a bunch of them over the past 50 years, but I prefer round ball. In .36 caliber, round balls are very pleasant to shoot. If I am deliberately hunting and need the "power" of a conical, I would just go with one of several .44's I possess. Either projectile is historically accurate, and while am certain conicals were more widely used due to paper cartridges, round balls were not uncommon. I reckon it all depends on what you want to do with your gun, for just plinking, round balls are great. If maximum energy is your goal, go with a conical. BTW, while I don't recommend it, I did kill a large buck with my favorite (Pietta) 1851 .36 navy several years ago with a round ball. Clean kill at under 20 yards. Was not really hunting, but the opportunity presented itself as I was cutting wood during deer season, and that was the gun I had. Legal where I live, but not in every jurisdiction. I got a Lee mold that casts both a 130 grain conical, and a .375 round ball. Don't know if they still make such a thing.

 

[nkbj]

Hey there kyron4.
It's hard enough to find a mold that fits a .36 but Pietta chambers run smallish in diameter which makes it really hard to find a mold for bullets you can load without getting poor alignment.
There's a few ways to skin that cat.
You can use over size balls that turn into slightly longer bullets when you force them in. Funneling the chamber mouths a little can help with that.
You can get a high priced mold made to produce bullets that fit your gun.
You can get the chambers reamed larger in diameter for about 3/16" deep to let you start bullets by hand.

 

[nkbj]

About that first suggestion...
Funneling the chamber mouths a little bit isn't at all uncommon. It helps bullets go in without so much of the shearing effect. You don't actually gain anything by shearing off a slender ring of lead when loading. It's better if all the lead squeezes down into the chamber. And by the way, bullets having a round hind end is actually a big plus because there's no way they become misaligned (like if a flat base on a bullet isn't perpendicular to the bore and produces a sideways thrust when leaving the muzzle).

 

[nkbj]

High priced molds...
In the late 70's I wanted a bullet heavier than round ball for my .36. So I took a relatively inexpensive Lee 111grain round nose mold for a 9mm and hogged the cavity out with a 3/8" drill bit. Cast them from soft lead and then rolled bevels onto the bases of the bullets. Being as the bullets are so soft and so small in caliber I could crunch 'em in on top of the powder and literally form fit them to the insides of the chambers. They shoot great. Still have the revolver and the mold.
Tried other stuff since then. Like this, a round ball mold with a cylindrical adjustable length tail end added to it. The diameter on the cylinder is precisely made to slip into a Pietta chamber. That's a 1858 instead of a 1851 but the Pietta chambers are the same diameter. The spherical portion of the bullets shear on the chamber mouths.

PS,
Accurate has some nifty .36 designs.
https://accuratemolds.com/catalog.php?page=11#catalog-anchor

 

[nkbj]

Chambers reaming...
I've recently had this done with a Pietta .44. The idea is to have a short length of the front ends of the chambers slightly larger than the groove diameter in the barrel. The bullets are sized to slide into the front of the chambers and then stop at the point where the chambers get smaller, thus obtaining the bullets' alignment and sealing of the chambers when the bullets' bases are forced into the portion with the originally factory supplied diameter.
The down side to doing this with a .36 is the dearth of available molds suitable for use with a .36. With a .44, eh, no problem because there's bunches of orphaned .45 pistol molds floating around looking for a new home. For .36 though almost everything is too small or too large. We live in an imperfect world.

 

[RiverRat]

I also vote for rbs in .36cal. I don’t think you are going to do any hunting with a 36 so RBs would be the best shooting and economical in your revolver.

 

[nkbj]

Like with Elmer Keith taking hens with his 1851 I reckon it just depends on what you're hunting.

 

[kyron4]

I got a Lee mold that casts both a 130 grain conical, and a .375 round ball. Don't know if they still make such a thing.

Yes, several retailers list them for sale. Since I'm just going to use it it as a "plinker" it sounds like the .375" round ball is the way to go.

 

[justinoldguy]

Yes, several retailers list them for sale. Since I'm just going to use it it as a "plinker" it sounds like the .375" round ball is the way to go.

I think that is a good decision. Just for shooting paper or drilling a steel can of some sort, I shoot 22 grains volume of Pyro RS (not a typo), for about 850fps. Accurate load and mild. When I'm out fishing or walking around the woods, I load to get 1100 fps, which is more effective on varmints, including those with less than four legs. Additionally, while your gun will almost certainly impact high with round ball, using conicals will raise the POI to a level where satellites may be in danger. I can hold a little low and still hit reliably with RB. But in some of my Navies, the conicals hit anywhere from 18" to 30" high at 25 yards. That is fairly difficult to guesstimate.

 

[kyron4]

I think that is a good decision. Just for shooting paper or drilling a steel can of some sort, I shoot 22 grains volume of Pyro RS (not a typo), for about 850fps. Accurate load and mild. When I'm out fishing or walking around the woods, I load to get 1100 fps, which is more effective on varmints, including those with less than four legs. Additionally, while your gun will almost certainly impact high with round ball, using conicals will raise the POI to a level where satellites may be in danger. I can hold a little low and still hit reliably with RB. But in some of my Navies, the conicals hit anywhere from 18" to 30" high at 25 yards. That is fairly difficult to guesstimate.

Yikes !

 

[ernbar]

Best way to know is to try them out and see which one is best for you. For me, .375 round balls work best both in accuracy and loading ease specially when using paper envelopes.

 

[Frontstuffer070]

I agree for general plinking the round ball is your friend. Lead goes further too. And 15 grains of 3F is a great plinking charge and again, your powder will go a little further as well.

 

[rodwha]

Yes, several retailers list them for sale. Since I'm just going to use it it as a "plinker" it sounds like the .375" round ball is the way to go.

I’d recommend a .380” ball because of those grossly undersized chambers. With a little more lead meat there along the edges you’ll have more that can be obturated to fill the grooves. It seems when shooting these guns with the slightly larger and heavier ball you actually get a little higher velocities as it’s filling the grooves properly.

 

[rodwha]

I think that is a good decision. Just for shooting paper or drilling a steel can of some sort, I shoot 22 grains volume of Pyro RS (not a typo), for about 850fps. Accurate load and mild. When I'm out fishing or walking around the woods, I load to get 1100 fps, which is more effective on varmints, including those with less than four legs. Additionally, while your gun will almost certainly impact high with round ball, using conicals will raise the POI to a level where satellites may be in danger. I can hold a little low and still hit reliably with RB. But in some of my Navies, the conicals hit anywhere from 18" to 30" high at 25 yards. That is fairly difficult to guesstimate.

Interesting as my .44 NMA doesn’t print high, but low with balls and just a little low with bullets. All shots are to the left though…

 

[justinoldguy]

Interesting as my .44 NMA doesn’t print high, but low with balls and just a little low with bullets. All shots are to the left though…

Colt repros almost always hit high, while Remington repros almost always hit low. The Remington's are easily adjusted for elevation by just filing down front sight. Colt repros can be brought to point of aim by cutting notch in hammer deeper, and filing down to lower point of impact. Windage is a tougher fix, and the Colt design actually is easier to adjust by moving notch left or right a few hundreths. My 3rd Model Dragoon shot an excellent group at 20 yards, however, it was 6" right. I brought it to correct windage by filing the notch wider, only working on the left edge. Still shoots high, but I live with that on Colts, as they mostly all do. My only exception is my newest 1861 Uberti Navy that shoots straight to POA. Remingtons are adjustable for windage, but require bending the front sight, or widening the groove on the top strap. Neither of those options are appealing to me.

 

[Johnnyntrain]

Got a steel framed 36 caliber Pietta 1851 on the way and I'm looking at Lee moulds. For those who have fired both in that gun which do you prefer ? Are Lee 130 gr. conicals less accurate than balls ? Do I want the .375" balls or the .380" balls ? Anything else I should be aware of ? -Thanks

380.
Ernbar is correct. You should buy a small amount of 375 and 380, every gun is different. My pietta takes 375 . My second generation colt likes 380. If need be you could add 1% tin to lessen shrinkage to a 375 mold ,only 1%. Eras Gone makes my 375 conical and is a good fit.