Powder behind the lock

[MDK_WV]

I recently bought a T/C Renegade .50 cal. flintlock, my first flintlock. I hunted with it briefly for one season. I then found a .62 cal. Green Mountain smoothbore barrel for it. I was able to take it to the range for a short practice session prior to hunting season. Not being confident shoot beyond 50 yards I carried it hunting for many days before getting a shot. I noticed while hunting I would lose the prime in my pan. After the hunting season was over I took the lock off for a thorough cleaning; I noticed the area between the lock and the wood was black. I found my priming powder. What can I do to seal this “crack” between the Green Mountain barrel and the stock where the pan doesn’t sit tight against the barrel? I never lost my priming powder with the original T/C barrel.

 

[BrownBear]

I'd just smear the crack with beeswax. Haven't had to do that myself, but it's the easiest solution I can think of. If the crack is wide enough, there might be some merit in wedghing a thin piece of leather in there as you seat the barrel for more security with lots of shooting, but I'm speculating.

 

[Mike Brooks]

I'd inlet the lock properly so the lock bolster lies properly against the barrel.

 

[LRB]

Three causes and corrections. If you have a gap between the lock bolster and the barrel, you will need to inlet the lock deeper and eliminate the gap. If you have a vent liner with a screw driver slot, this slot needs to run parallel with the barrel, and not be in a position to funnel powder into the lock. You may have to correctly fit a new vent liner. The vent liner also needs to be flush with the barrel, and not below or above the surface, or that may allow powder to enter the lock.

 

[BrownBear]

Those are good tips I'm going to file away Wick. Thanks. He sezz the fit is fine with the orginal TC barrel, so unless the GM barrel is slightly smaller, I think you've hit the nail on the old square head.

Edit-

On re-reading his post, it looks as though there's a visble gab between the barrel and side plate with the GM barrel, and not with the TC barrel. That speaks of smaller dimensions on the GM. Setting the lock plate deeper would certainly cure it for the GM barrel, provided he never wanted to put the TC barrel back on.

A case of the prior GM owner getting a little too enthused with the draw file?

Connundrums.

 

[Emet Huntsman]

I would be very leery of any situation where the prime builds up behind the lock. I don't know what critical mass would be, but I can imagine a point where a spark could send your lock where you don't want it and ruin your stock -- not to mention your day! :shocked2:

 

[MDK_WV]

Three causes and corrections. If you have a gap between the lock bolster and the barrel, you will need to inlet the lock deeper and eliminate the gap. The lock is already even or slightly counter sunk in the stock. The pan is not touching the barrel, should it touch the barrel? If you have a vent liner with a screw driver slot, this slot needs to run parallel with the barrel, and not be in a position to funnel powder into the lock. The vent liner is one from GM; it has a hex head socket . You may have to correctly fit a new vent liner. The vent liner also needs to be flush with the barrel, and not below or above the surface, or that may allow powder to enter the lock. The problem as I can see it is the pan needs to touch the barrel or I need to put something in the gap to keep the prime from getting down in the crack and eventually behind the lock. If I use a wax will it melt and run away or get up in my touch hole?

Brown Bear mentioned the smaller dimension. The GM barrel is supposed to be the same 1” barrel. However I changed the barrels in and out to compare and the GM barrel is a fraction smaller. I can hook a finger nail in the difference where the barrel hooks into the stock. I have no way to measure the gap, but by the naked eye it seems to be the same. I don’t think I want to inlet the lock and then not be able to change barrels in the future.
Any help or opinions will be appreciated.

 

[LRB]

Then you need to inlet deeper. If you merely fill the gap, you will still have a gap at the frizzen which is not good either. The only other way as I see it, would be a shim plate soldered on the barrel that closes the gap for the pan and frizzen. Then you would need to fit a new vent liner to that. If done carefully the shim may not be all that noticiable.

 

[fitter]

Use some kind of transfer color and inlet the lock a little deeper. Pretty simple fix.

 

[Zonie]

Before you start increasing the depth of the mortice for the lock, take a good hard look at the distance between the locks bolster and the side of the barrel.

A surprisingly small gap can cause the loss of the pans powder down into the mortice behind the lock.

If the gap is only about .010-.015 (3-5 thicknesses of printer paper) sometimes just scraping the stock finish off of the surfaces that the lockplate sits on will be enough to fix the problem.

IMO, the best way to increase the depth, whether it is just removing the stock finish or some actual wood, is to use a sharp scraper.
The end of a small chisel will work nicely by holding the end of the blade perpendicular to the wood and scraping it along the surface.

Scrape a bit, then try the lock. Do this several times, sneaking up on the right depth.

One of the easiest mistakes to make is to position the tip of the chisel in its normal cutting position and then pushing it along.
Doing this will produce a nice curl of wood but more often than not it will cut away too much wood.

Wood is a lot easier to remove than it is to replace.

OH, you'r lucky the loose priming powder behind your lockplate didn't ignite. That's been known to blow the bottom wood out of a stock.

 

[MDK_WV]

I have looked at this again and tried to take a picture, but my camera will not focus in close enough to get a clear picture of the size of my gap between the barrel and the pan. I agree wood is hard to replace and what you are telling me is if I cut or shave the wood down to make the lock fit tight against the .62 cal. barrel, I can pretty much give up ever putting the .50 cal. T/C barrel back on this flintlock?

I need to look at this some more and consider what you have told me before I make my next move.

 

[jethro224]

:hmm: Pick up another stock on ebay etc.

 

[Zonie]

Assuming the original barrel mated nicely with the original lock, I don't see why the original lock will not mate with the .62 caliber barrel unless the .62 caliber barrel is smaller externally.

Assuming both barrels are the same size and the lock will not mate with the .62 caliber barrel, I doubt that it mated properly with the original barrel either.

If both barrels are the same external size in the area of the lock, adjusting the locks position so that it lightly touches the side of the .62 caliber barrel should not prevent the original barrel from also working like it should.

In other words, if the barrels are externally the same, the lock in its readjusted position should work with either barrel.

 

[stubshaft]

Could it be possible that you got a barrel for a T/C Hawken which measures 15/16" between flats? They look almost identical and the Hawken has the same hook on it.

 

[MDK_WV]

I don’t have caliper to measure this barrel at the breech plug, but using a metal ruler it measures 1” at the muzzle. The barrel fits the stock down to the lock. The barrel has a slightly different color of metal 15/16” long at the breech plug. Where the barrel hooks in the tang there is a lip. I can’t accurately measure this but it appears to be slightly less than an inch (31/32)? It appears the barrel may have a taper for the last 1-1/2” to less than an inch, in the area of the pan and frizzen. Is it possible the wrong breech plug was installed on the barrel? The hook in the tang is not as tight as the T/C barrel.

 

[Mike Payne]

I think Zonie's fix would work but after scraping the inside of the lock mortice to fit the lock to 62 barrel you could put the TC back in. Then make some shims out of copper or brass to go behind the lock to fit it to the TC barrel.

Mike

 

[gordy]

After reading all the posts and doing a little thinking (ouch). I sounds as if there has been a mix-up when the breech plug was installed? If you can feel a ledge between the edge of the plug and the side of th barrel this could well be the problem ! If I read properly you said there was a gap between the side of the barrel and the stock ? But it looked like the barrel fit the stock at the forend ? Even if it were a 15/16th barrel in a 1" barrel mortise it woukd touch the bottom of the chanel and give the appearence of fitting.
I think you have a 15/16" barrel instead of a 1" !Before I did any chopping I'd find someone with a srt of mics ann get an accurate measurement ? It would still be possibke to make the barrel work and change out with the original by the use of brass shim stock ! :thumbsup:

 

[123.DieselBenz]

Kinda different way to look at this but what size of powder are you using in the pan?

Try some 2f . . . might not sift through the tiny crack . . . or maybe I'm all wet! :grin:

 

[Toomuch_36]

One question jumps to mind with your mention of a difference in barrel dimentions (breach vs muzzle).
Was this barrel bought new or privatly from someone who may have modified it to fit a 15/16 Hawken stock he may have had?

Toomuch
............
shoot Flint

 

[CoyoteJoe]

If a 15/16 breechplug were installed on a 1" barrel you wouldn't be wondering about it, the difference would be glaringly obvious. Leave the inlet alone at the bottom and scrape away wood at the top to bring the lock bolster in to touch the barrel flat. That will cause no problem with reinstalling the T/C barrel.