SOLD REDUCED Navy Arms Hawken Hunter .58

[BigSkyRambler]

These are kind of scarce. This is a Navy Arms Hawken Hunter rifle in .58 caliber. It dates from the early 1970’s and was possibly made for Navy Arms by Ithaca. Val Forgett, founder of Navy Arms, took one to Africa and hunted The Big Five dangerous game with it. It is rifled for conical projectiles, with a1:48” twist. Wide, shallow rifling like a Springfield rifled musket. Condition is overall Good Plus. The walnut stock is in good shape, with the exception of a solidly repaired crack at tang. This was a common problem, as many people taking them down assumed they had a hooked breech like a TC Hawken. So they removed the barrel wedge and lifted barrel, cracking stock where the tang screw went through. I have added an extra reinforcement of a seel pin for good measure. Length of pull is 13-1/4” from the center of the crescent buttplate to the trigger. Overall length is 42”. The heavy 27" octagonal barrel is 1-1/8” across the flats, and quite thick-walled, which makes this gun muzzle heavy. Barrel retains about 90% blue with some freckling and edge wear. The total weight is 8-1/2 pounds, which moderates the recoil quite a bit. The bore is good plus with minor pitting. The rear sight can be adjusted for elevation and windage. Brass blade front sight. It has a single trigger (not a set trigger). Brass tipped steel ramrod. $450 SHIPPED.

 

[BigSkyRambler]

Before you ask!

 

[BigSkyRambler]

Monday Bump.

 

[Old Hawkeye]

It was my understanding that Val Forgett used the "Buffalo Hunter" (patterned after the Zouave) made for Navy Arms by Antonio Zolli for his African foray. The barrel was made extra thick & could handle charges up to 200 grains under a 600 grain Minie! IIRC, the Hawken Hunter was rated for charges approaching 150 grains. Neither rifle was a reproduction of a rifle that ever existed, but they were the "Magnums" of their day & very well made.

 

[BigSkyRambler]

It was my understanding that Val Forgett used the "Buffalo Hunter" (patterned after the Zouave) made for Navy Arms by Antonio Zolli for his African foray. The barrel was made extra thick & could handle charges up to 200 grains under a 600 grain Minie! IIRC, the Hawken Hunter was rated for charges approaching 150 grains. Neither rifle was a reproduction of a rifle that ever existed, but they were the "Magnums" of their day & very well made.

Here is an older post from this site.
New to me Navy Arms .58 Hawken Hunter | The Muzzleloading Forum

 

[Old Hawkeye]

I think if you look closely at the picture with the gun leaning on the Zebra you can see the brass patch box in the buttstock. In the darker text just below the picture it even says Buffalo Hunter. That is definitely a Buffalo Hunter. In my copy of the book you can also see it has a round barrel. So the picture & text contradict what the poster said. A little research will also reveal more about Forgett's African hunt & that he used the Buffalo Hunter, not the Hawken Hunter. The fella in the thread you refer to was just simply mistaken about what gun Forgett used. No offense intended. Your Hawken Hunter is still a nice rifle & you shouldn't have any trouble selling it to a knowledgable buyer. It's just not the gun Forgett used. My post was just a FYI to correct an error.

 

[SDSmlf]

A little research will also reveal more about Forgett's African hunt & that he used the Buffalo Hunter, not the Hawken Hunter.

I am not a fact checker, but if one were to research, one would find Forgett took two 58 cal muzzleloaders (and a 50 cal, likely a Navy Hawken Hurricane), a pre production (Forgett said they would put them into production after the trip if they worked well - not the exact quote, as I don’t have reference in front of me) 58 cal Hawken loaded with a 610 grain Minie over 180 grains of 3F, and the lighter Navy Buffalo Hunter, using 100 to 125 grains of 3F. He shot game with both 58s and the 50. The Hawken I believe went to production (there may have been changes from the pre production Hawken Forgett used) as the Hawken Hunter. I remember Forgett writing that the PH referred to the Hawken as ‘Big Daddy’ or something similar.

I am very sure of the above and could post scans of articles from mid 1970s publications like G&A Guide to Blackpowder and the Lyman Handbook later tonight when I get home. Forgett’s writings actually inspired me to go and hunt plains game in Africa.

And for what it is worth, I believe the OPs claim is correct.

This is a Navy Arms Hawken Hunter rifle in .58 caliber. It dates from the early 1970’s and was made for Navy Arms by Ithaca. Val Fogert, founder of Navy Arms, took one to Africa and hunted The Big Five dangerous game with it.

I think if you look closely at the picture with the gun leaning on the Zebra you can see the brass patch box in the buttstock. In the darker text just below the picture it even says Buffalo Hunter. That is definitely a Buffalo Hunter. In my copy of the book you can also see it has a round barrel. So the picture & text contradict what the poster said. A little research will also reveal more about Forgett's African hunt & that he used the Buffalo Hunter, not the Hawken Hunter. The fella in the thread you refer to was just simply mistaken about what gun Forgett used. No offense intended. Your Hawken Hunter is still a nice rifle & you shouldn't have any trouble selling it to a knowledgable buyer. It's just not the gun Forgett used. My post was just a FYI to correct an error.

 

[Eterry]

According to Lymans Black Powder Forgett took at least two 58 caliber rifles to Africa. A Hawken he used to take Elephant and Hippo and a Buffalo Hunter he used to take lion and a zebra.

I think BigSkyRambler deserves an apology.

 

[OldMaineWoodsman]

I'm more interested in the connection to Ithaca? I have never heard this before. I know that Ithaca worked with Navy Arms on the Ithaca/Navy Hawken with both completed rifles and kits, but was not aware they manufactured other models for Navy Arms?

And yes, in the Lyman Black Powder Handbook (mine is 1975), Val Forgett describes using both the Hawken Hunter and Buffalo Hunter in .58 caliber along with images on an African trip in the article titled "Muzzleloaders and Really Big Game" on pages 20-25.

Nice rifle that does not turn up often. Good luck on the sale.

 

[SDSmlf]

could scans of articles from mid 1970s publications like G&A Guide to Blackpowder

I hesitate posting scans to a for sale thread, but am going to because it clarifies the OP that was falsely challenged. I wonder if BigSkyRambler gets an apology? I am only posting scans from the 1974 G&A Guide to Blackpowder, as most seem to have the Lyman BP Handbook.

was not aware they manufactured other models for Navy Arms?

It’s possible Ithaca was involved, as these Navy Arms guns were manufactured in the USA, but I couldn’t prove they were actually made by Ithaca. Here is more info from the G&A article.

 

[BigSkyRambler]

I honestly don't need an apology. People, including myself, often post incorrect information thinking it helps. I have on occasion been less than helpful.
But to salve my bruised ego someone could buy it..

 

[BigSkyRambler]

Warts and all, this is a great rifle.Reduced to include shipping.

 

[Africa58double]

Hmmm ,Need more information about the rifle.
Just kidding.

Nice looking Big Sky

 

[BigSkyRambler]

Hmmm ,Need more information about the rifle.
Just kidding.

Nice looking Big Sky

I could take more bore photos. Maybe a 360° tour of the whole inside of the barrel. Someone out there is bound to demand a microscopic metallurgical study of the whole gun. Just because.

 

[BigSkyRambler]

Last drop. May have to go to sleep until Fall ML season approaches.

 

[Africa58double]

Think you meant Fall “Rino” season- that’s a bruiser of a Rifle for big game!
Nice Looking cannon !

 

[BigSkyRambler]

Think you meant Fall “Rino” season- that’s a bruiser of a Rifle for big game!
Nice Looking cannon !

I think he took an elephant with it.

 

[BigSkyRambler]

Decided to let it go. Too many irons in fire. $450 shipped.