which is the better of the two ? comments, advice, and reason why . any knowledge is held with great respect....thank y'all..
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rifled or smoothbore barrel
- Thread starter hillbilly
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Ain't much of a smoothbore if it has rifling.
which barrel do you prefer to use and why?
Too general a question. Which is "better" depends on what it will be used for. A smoothbore is like a modern shotgun, which can be loaded with a variety of sizes of shot for various critters at close range or with a slug (ball) for reaching out a bit further or going after large critters. As such, it offers a good bit of versatility, but it's no match for a good rifle for long range work.
Smooth in a smoothbore so that way it is a smoothbore.
You Don't know much about guns it seems. A smoothbore is a shotgun.
A rifled bore is a rifle same as modern ones.
You Don't know much about guns it seems. A smoothbore is a shotgun.
A rifled bore is a rifle same as modern ones.
sorry to all reading , let me fine tune this . I am doing an build and am not sure which barrel to go with.
the build is a .50cal flintlock. and looking for the knowledge of others in this skill for there choice and reason why
for a more all around use.
the build is a .50cal flintlock. and looking for the knowledge of others in this skill for there choice and reason why
for a more all around use.
Well, @hillbilly, the answer still depends on what you intend to use this firearm for. The choice can very well depend on the use.
yes you are right, the go to all around hunt anything rifle would be smoothbore...
A rifle is rifled to shoot single projectiles (roundballs). Shotgun pellets (buckshot) do not work well at all in a rifled barrel. Smoothbores have no rifling. They will shoot buckshot well, but will not shoot a projectile (ball) as well or with near the accuracy/distance as a rifle. If going for a smoothbore a 50 cal is small. 62 cal smoothbore is a 20 gauge. For all around hunting a smoothbore can be used as a shotgun for small game and turkey. You can shoot roundballs in a smoothbore out to about 50 yards with some accuracy. Beyond that you will need a rifle for good accuracy.
A smooths a smooth and a rifles rifled, methinks.
Better is some sort of modern hunting rifle fitted with a good scope. Depending on your game and conditions as small as 5.5mm up to .50 nitro express.
Howsomever we choose to handicap ourselves with a short range messy single shot gun, and if used in hunting we have to get around its limitations. No popping an elk from three hundred yards away for us.
A ml rifle shooting a round ball is deadly at a hundred yards or a bit more and of large enough caliber may reliably take game at longer range. You may find some folk on this forum who have gotten twohundred yard kills with ball. Lots of practice and load development and right conditions. So let’s say for basic a rifle will serve as a hunter to a hundred yards.
A smooth bore is more limited. Again folks have done some work out to a hundred that with practice, load development and right conditions you can get. In general it’s a fifty yard gun.
Smoothbores do have a versatility in you can load shot and hunt bunny or Turkey and deer or elk in range the next day
I love my smoothies. And if I was going to have to survive in the woods it’s what I would grab, but it has more limitations then a rifle.
historicly from 1607- 1750 there were few rifles guns in America. After 1750 the numbers grew and America became a riflemans country. But during the ML era, right up to the 1860s smoothbores remained very popular where people hunted if not for a living at least for a valuable food source.
During the westren fur trade it was said Indians and Canadians would take a smoothbore while “Americans” reached for a rifle.
All are fun to shoot, all are historic and all are game getters if used correctly.
At this point I would insert a comment about real men shoot flint lock smooth bores, or fusil separate men from boys or some such and it would be just ribbing. Neither one has any advantage over the other except looking at one aspect. Rifles are accurate and longer ranged, smoothbores are versatile.
Howsomever we choose to handicap ourselves with a short range messy single shot gun, and if used in hunting we have to get around its limitations. No popping an elk from three hundred yards away for us.
A ml rifle shooting a round ball is deadly at a hundred yards or a bit more and of large enough caliber may reliably take game at longer range. You may find some folk on this forum who have gotten twohundred yard kills with ball. Lots of practice and load development and right conditions. So let’s say for basic a rifle will serve as a hunter to a hundred yards.
A smooth bore is more limited. Again folks have done some work out to a hundred that with practice, load development and right conditions you can get. In general it’s a fifty yard gun.
Smoothbores do have a versatility in you can load shot and hunt bunny or Turkey and deer or elk in range the next day
I love my smoothies. And if I was going to have to survive in the woods it’s what I would grab, but it has more limitations then a rifle.
historicly from 1607- 1750 there were few rifles guns in America. After 1750 the numbers grew and America became a riflemans country. But during the ML era, right up to the 1860s smoothbores remained very popular where people hunted if not for a living at least for a valuable food source.
During the westren fur trade it was said Indians and Canadians would take a smoothbore while “Americans” reached for a rifle.
All are fun to shoot, all are historic and all are game getters if used correctly.
At this point I would insert a comment about real men shoot flint lock smooth bores, or fusil separate men from boys or some such and it would be just ribbing. Neither one has any advantage over the other except looking at one aspect. Rifles are accurate and longer ranged, smoothbores are versatile.
Buck Conner
40 Cal
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I hunted for 18-20 years with a NW Tradegun, have killed anything from mulies, elk to 2000 lb. buffalo, all with the useless smooth bore. "Useless my ass", first off it's about bullet (ball) placement on your animal. I've killed over a dozen buffalo in that many years for those with rifled gun that couldn't keep the animal on the ground because of just that - bullet (ball) placement. Agreed distance can change the game, the farthest I have personally taken a large animal is in the 80-85 yard range. At this distance we have been using lung shots having a larger area for placement. But like said it's about bullet (ball) placement.
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thank you ,with great respect,,
Buck Conner
40 Cal
Who said anything about useless? The original OP doesn’t seem to know the difference between a smoothbore and a rifle. I was trying to break it down in the simplest terms. I too hunt with a smoothbore but it’s not something a newbie should be led to believe he can shoot 2 inch groups with at 100 yards. Minute of deer or Buffalo yes. Target shooting no. The problem is the OP didn’t state what he wants to do with his gun other than all around hunting. Is that all around small game, all around big game or hunting anything from chipmunks to elephants. Might wanna grab the reading glasses and read my post again.
hanshi
Cannon
A .50 smoothbore might not be legal for turkey in some states but are still useful with shot for small game. A round ball can be loaded patched, just like a rifle, and take deer at reasonable range. My smoothbore is a .62 (20 ga) and has taken deer with ball. With shot it's good for small game and turkey.
Some build a smoothbore with an octagonal barrel, front and rear sights (my .62 has them) and a stock & hardware just like a rifle; often called a "smooth rifle". With the heavier barrel round ball accuracy is usually almost rifle-like up past 50+ yards. As long as you don't plan on taking shots much past 50 yards or so with ball, a smooth bore barrel in .50 will work on deer & black bear as well as small game with shot. "Britsmoothy", a frequent poster on this site, uses a .45 smoothrifle for wing shooting and taking small game at fairly long ranges.
Some build a smoothbore with an octagonal barrel, front and rear sights (my .62 has them) and a stock & hardware just like a rifle; often called a "smooth rifle". With the heavier barrel round ball accuracy is usually almost rifle-like up past 50+ yards. As long as you don't plan on taking shots much past 50 yards or so with ball, a smooth bore barrel in .50 will work on deer & black bear as well as small game with shot. "Britsmoothy", a frequent poster on this site, uses a .45 smoothrifle for wing shooting and taking small game at fairly long ranges.
Well for me a smoothbore is the best for squirrel and turkey and a running rabbit. Because IF I shoot up at a squirrel on a branch, I don't know where the ball will go when it passes through the animal, and the area that I hunt squirrels is too close to populated areas to risk the bad press that I popped somebody's car or worse while using a muzzleloader. I can use the smoothie for both fall and spring turkey.
The .54 caliber rifle is great on sitting rabbits, and on deer, and will reach out and touch a deer, dropping them in their tracks at as far away as 110 yards. I've eaten a lot of venison taken with my .54.
LD
Smooth, plenty accurate for the ranges I am going to personally use a muzzleloader for, and it is easy to clean if you are just plinking. Which, if we are honest is most of what we do. And I understood your question, not sure were all the confusion is coming from.
I ve not taken a deer this century with a rifle. It seems I started with a percussion rifle.but everything that drew me to ml was more so with flint. And all that drew me to ml was more so again with smoothbores
I’m kinda afraid to shoot a matchlock
I’m kinda afraid to shoot a matchlock
Welcome to the forum, hillbilly!
In very general terms, I would suggest a smoothbore for versatility or a rifle for accuracy. Your .50 caliber barrel, if a smoothbore, would be roughly equivalent to a 37 gauge shotgun (.501"), which is nonexistent in the modern world but certainly possible with a muzzleloader. Ballistically, I would think shot loads would be somewhere between a .410 shotgun and a 28 gauge shotgun, to put it in more understandable terms. I think Britsmoothy, one of the gentlemen who posts regularly on this board, has enjoyed excellent results with shot loads in smoothbores of small caliber, and we hope he will contribute to this discussion. However, I think with shot loads, you would be limited to very small game (squirrels, rabbits, and birds) at relatively close range. I think you can take buckshot loads off the table altogether in this case... I can't think of anything I would want to shoot with buckshot out of a .50 caliber smoothbore.
You can certainly shoot patched round balls from a smoothbore, and there are plenty of people here who report very good accuracy with these out to 50 yards or so. I am not one of them.
If you are building your .50 caliber flintlock to look like a rifle, with a full octagon barrel, rear sight, and rifle-styled butt stock, but you build it as a smoothbore, you will have what the old timers called "a smoothbore rifle," although most people now would call it just a "smooth rifle," or even a "smoothie." I believe you would find this an awkward gun to use for wing shooting. I think the optimal targets for shot loads in a smoothbore of that gauge would be stationary or slow-moving small game at relatively close distance, unless you are an exceptional wing shot. Ball loads might take up to deer-sized game a little further out, but everything would depend on your skill as a marksman and your ability to develop an appropriate load.
If you are just gathering information and listening to opinions here, with regard to your .50 caliber project gun, that's one thing. If you are looking for recommendations, I would recommend that you build a rifle. Work up a good, accurate load with a patched round ball and you can confidently go after deer at reasonable ranges, take small game with head shots, and seriously compete in matches with your local club.
Rifles tend to be more muzzle-heavy, to facilitate deliberate aiming. Smoothbored fowling pieces, the shotguns of the flintlock era, tend to be a bit lighter in the muzzle and more nimble. "Smooth rifles" are hybrids, incorporating the best and the worst of both. They can be useful, versatile, and a lot of fun to shoot, but they also have their limitations.
I think there are probably very few of us here who have only one gun. Maybe after you finish your rifle your next build could be a smoothbore of somewhat larger gauge.
Those are my thoughts on the topic. Others' opinions are just as valid. There are plenty of people here rooting for your success!
Best regards,
Notchy Bob
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