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Safe loads for civil war era musket ?

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Skychief

69 Cal.
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I have a smoothbore (mics @ .642) musket marked 1865 on it and it is original with NO doubt. My question is about proper loads. I plan to turkey hunt with it starting the 23rd of this month. So, what are the heaviest loads for turkey hunting this old gal will handle safely? I should say, when running a cleaning patch downbore, I notice a bit of a "void" (larger bore) about 3/4" in front of the breech running the same to the breech. Please bear this in mind when answering please. The gun has been shot about 10 times with a load of 65-70 grains 2f under 1 7/8 oz. of 6 shot. No ill effects were seen such as gas leakage at the breech/barrel interface. Since then, I have been told that is too heavy a load. I appreciate all replies as you have the experience that I lack in smoothbores! Skychief.
 
I don't think there is any way to say. It would have originally been a rifle musket that has been bored out to a smoothbore. Condition of the barrel and how professionally it was bored out would be determining factors.
 
Heaviest Load is not the question you should be asking. That question indicates you are thinking in terms of Smokeless powder loads in modern guns.

This is a Black Powder gun. Its an OLD BP gun. It has NO CHOKE. BP does not produce the velocities that you can get from Smokeless powders. Because of the lack of choke, this is basically a 25 yard gun, and you don't need lots of velocity at the muzzle to kill a turkey at that short range.

What you need instead is the ability to call the bird in close enough to you. You will experience the frustration of seeing birds come inside 50 yards, where, if you had a modern shotgun, with full choke, or " Extra Full Choke" you could kill the bird, but because you only have your Civil War Vintage BP shotgun, you don't dare take the shot, and perhaps cripple and lose a fine animal.

You have a 17.5 gauge shotgun, half way between an 18 gauge and a 17 gauge. You should be able to order wads from Circle Fly in 17 gauge; if not, use 16 gauge wads. They will be tight, but then you won't be shooting a lot either. Stick to LIGHT 16 gauge loads, to protect the gun. Light loads tend to have MVs under 1100 fps, and that will give you a tighter pattern than if you go over that velocity. At short range, use #6 shot. Test fire it to determine POA vs. POI on paper, and stick with loads using 60-75 grains of FFg powder, and 1 oz. of shot. There are 225, .11" diameter pellets in an ounce of #6 shot, and at 25 yards, you should have enough hits in the neck and head to kill a turkey.

Put out both hen and jake decoys to bring them in close, as in Spring seasons, the Older Toms are as interested in fighting off the young jakes, as they are loving the hens. Yelp calls that immitate hens bring the Toms to interest in the girls, but a " gobble " call that imitates another tom, or " jake " will bring them in running and spoiling for a fight. At least, that is the theory. I did see it happen once.
 
The standard grainage for cartridges fired in the .58 and .577 rifled muskets in the Civil War was 60 grains.This enabled accurate fire out to at least 200 yards and effective fire even further.I would think that significantly less would be more than adequate for turkey although 60 grains ahould be fine for most other types of game.
Tom Patton
 
I'd definitely stick with Paul's suggestion of 1 oz of shot to keep pressures down and that's if I really HAD to shoot the old gun at all. You have a gun that is circa 140 years old. It has been exposed to who knows what extremes of heat, etc over the years. You know that there has been erosion down near the breech. How thick is the remaining steel? Is there an unseen (from the muzzle) pit or pits that go even deeper?

You have a collectable firearm and only one set of eyes and other body parts. That old musket might still be shooting after another hundred years but it might also let go on the next shot. That possibility is always there every time you fire it. If you brought your musket to my shop I'd strongly suggest that we preserve it in its current condition and that you go get a newer gun for hunting. It's just not worth the risk of destroying the gun and possible injury to death to you and/or others around you.

Storm
 
I agree with Stormrider.
That "void" near the breech that you described would be a big concern to me. I'm not sure I would want to fire that gun. Maybe you can get a competent muzzleloader gunsmith to check it out.
 
Stormrider51 said:
How thick is the remaining steel?

Storm


This is what I would like to know. I know of no way to say for sure without pulling the breechplug out. I don't know if that is a good idea with a gun this old though. I have many good friends that are deeply involved with black powder shooting. They all say that they would NOT hesitate to shoot the gun. These men shoot regularly at Friendship and serve on some of the commitees even. They are no strangers to older guns. The advice here, by and large, are to retire the gun or shoot VERY light loads. So, I am in somewhat of a quandry! I really like the idea of turkey hunting with this original! What to do.........I appreciate all of your thoughts as I respect the members here as well as my friends. Skychief.
 
Sky,
You could have the barrel fluroscoped (sp?) to reveal any hidden flaws and the extent of the erosion at the breech but that will be expensive. What you do is up to you as far as shooting goes. I haven't seen your gun. I can only give cautionary advice. Shooting a gun that might turn into a hand grenade is a serious risk. But then I ride a Harley Davidson motorcycle as my daily transportation and that isn't exactly safe either.

Storm
 
After reading all this, I sure would like to see some pics of this gun!

Sounds possibly like an old charge was left in the gun, which may have caused some corrosion in that breach area?

How does the bore look?
 
Mule,
That's exactly what I was thinking. A charge left in the breech for who knows how long. I'd be really worried about the extent of damage.

Storm
 
I'd take it to a competent gunsmith before working up a load.What type of musket are we dealing with here?If it started life as a .577/.58 rifled musket and was bored out, the barrel walls may be rather thin.Add to that the weaker metals and 143 years of "who knows what went on".Was this weapon from a relation?Perhaps you could consider a reproduction.Best regards,J.A.
 
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