Seating a Tightly Patched Ball?

[Josh Smith]

Hello,

I've come around to this again. While the .010" patches seal well enough for hunting and provide decent accuracy, I felt the need to play with the thicker patches as I get burn-through if I do not use a over-powder wad (I prefer jumbo sized cotton balls).

So I cut some about 1.5" square. I'll probably go circular one of these days just because I prefer it, but for experimenting, square will work just fine.

I lube these by throwing them in an old margarine tub, pouring just enough lanolin on them to saturate, but with nothing pooling in the bottom. I put the lid on and toss for uniformity.

I then pour melted Crisco over these, toss again, and while still warm, I put the patches onto paper towels, roll them up and wring them.

The patches end up at .022" with the micrometer barely touching, and .015" fully compressed.

I was having trouble seating the balls, so I made this:

The sticks are mulberry, which I've found to be very tough and flexible, and they dry readily in an oven. I will be adding brass rings to these when I find some that fit: .38spl brass is too small and .45acp is too big. I'll probably have to get a couple .40S&W cases.

Anyway, this starts the ball very easily, with both the short end and 7" end.

The problem arises when I go to use the ramrod. It bends. I do not own, nor do I plan to own, a range rod. To me, that defeats the purpose of the rifle being as self-contained as possible.

In order to fully seat the ball, I must tamp it down. I don't like this. I'd rather it slide smoothly.

I plan to make a removable T-handle for the rod tomorrow and see if that works. It certainly does for the seating rod.

Any other suggestions?

Thanks,

Josh

 

[Pete Gaimari]

Deforming the ball by tamping it down defeats the purpose of a tight patch.

I'd use thinner patches. If I can't push the ball down smoothly in one motion from top to powder, the patch is too thick.

 

[bwhoffman]

""""The problem arises when I go to use the ramrod. It bends. I do not own, nor do I plan to own, a range rod. To me, that defeats the purpose of the rifle being as self-contained as possible.

In order to fully seat the ball, I must tamp it down. I don't like this. I'd rather it slide smoothly.""""


Are you grabbing the rod about 6 inches up from the muzzle? We wouldnt want to hear tell of you breaking the ramrod and running it thru your hand. IT DOES HAPPEN!

I would strongly suggest getting a range rod with some backbone in it.

When hunting, in the field, you WANT a load that will go in with the tools at hand. The range or trail walk is a different story.

a tight ball/patch combo IS going to offer more friction. it is simple physics!

 

[Zonie]

Nothing wrong with your loading stick. In fact, it looks a lot like my short starter which is a round ball with a short (3/8") and a long (3 1/2) inch dowel sticking out of it.

After the ball is shoved down with the 3 1/2" dowel it us usually pretty easy to ram the rest of the way down the bore unless I haven't 'wiped' the bore for several shots.

I do wonder about the comment about the ramrod 'bending' though.

A bending ramrod indicates that it is being held too far away from the muzzle.

Some folks think that they should be able to ram the ball in one or two strokes. This kind of thinking usually leads to broken ramrods because they were never intended to be used in this manner.

When using a wooden ramrod the ball should be rammed down the bore in increments of 8-12 inches.
In my opinion, the ramming hand should never be positioned on the ramrod over 12 inches above the muzzle.

 

[Pete Gaimari]

I do it in one stroke Zonie. I go hand over hand 8" above the muzzle, but the rod never stops.

 

[Josh Smith]

Hi Folks,

I'm doing it as Zonie describes.

The ramrod is composite, is advertised as unbreakable, and matches the plastic stock on my CVA Bobcat nicely. (And that's the weird thing: The oldest style rifle I own is also the only plastic gun in my inventory right now since selling the LCP pistol. Can't wait to get a wood stocked muzzleloader!)

I'm having a heck of a time finding anything between the .010" and .022" patches I described, though I called Mom and she said there is a fabric store in town, which I plan to check out.

I almost wonder if I have enough lube on these things. They start stuttering near the bottom. Maybe I shouldn't wring them out so much - just pat them?

Thanks folks,

Josh

 

[Pete Gaimari]

Pillow ticking is .018. For my gun it's too thick and i'd have to beat it in. I gave in and buy precut patches in .015 and Mink Oil to lube them at TOW. Works perfect.

 

[FPDoc]

Walmart ticking is thinner than .018" (usually more like .014"-.015" I think). It is widely used by folks in this forum, you might give that a try.

 

[ohio ramrod]

I use a "T" handled starter much like your design with the handle made out of antler. I have a flat bottomed hole drilled about 1/4 inch deep to fit over the end of the ramrod so that I can use it over the end of the ramrod to tap the ball tight at the bottom. Also I might add that both the short starter and the ramrod ends have a concave radius to match the ball radius to prevet flatening the ball. :hmm:

 

[hoochiepapa]

You can get thin ticking from Hancock Fabrics. Just miked it, .012.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Please! Those synthetic sticks are as limp as a noodle. YOU get what you pay for.

BUY a good Hickory Ramrod, and pin the ferrules on the end so you can hold threaded jags for loading and cleaning the gun in the field. If you put the right ferrule on the opposite end, you can buy a "T-handle" that screws right in the ferrule.

Use the hand-over-hand technique for putting the PRB down the barrel. The barrel usually needs to be Wiped between shots to allow the ball to go down the barrel smoothly, no matter how well lubed your patches are. Otherwise, the crud in the barrel is going to stop that PRB periodically, and that is a ROYAL PITA!

Do as has been described. With a good hand-over-hand rhythm you should be able to push the PRB down the barrel without stopping, so that it goes to the MARK on your rod that indicates its on the powder, consistently. Load to your mark, not to the powder. You also should have a mark further down the barrel that indicates when you have your powder charge in the barrel, so you prevent yourself from loading a double powder charge, or worse, a double load! :shocked2: :nono:

I highly recommend you re think your idea of NOT purchasing a Range Rod. You will do more range shooting, than shots fired hunting, if you are like 99.99% of us. Your range rod is the GO-TO rod to pull balls from the gun, to do the cleaning chores, and to use when you are experimenting with new powders, powder charges, etc. before settling on the one you want to use in the woods when hunting.

When I hunt, I load the charge and PRB down the barrel either at home, with my range rod, or where I park my vehicle when I reach my hunting area. The Ramrod on my gun is really only a Loading rod, altho I do keep a cleaning jag on the ramrod, and use it to run damp cleaning patches down between shots. ( usually spit, but alcohol if the air temperature is below 32 degrees F.) I do the better cleaning back at my vehicle, where the range rod is left.

My Range rod is my back up in the field, along with tools I keep in my range box, in the car, that I can use to pull a stuck ramrod, or replace a broken part in the lock. ( It happens. :shocked2: ) I have hunted Deer in Southern Illinois, which is more than a 4 hour drive from my home. There simply is no sensible reason to leave my tools, extra parts, and range rod at home, when I am hunting that far away.

Pick out a hickory rod that has straight grain- no run-out. Then cut it to size, and fit the ferrules. It will last longer than you live, if you don't roll over it with a truck. It is far more Historically Correct to use hickory, than some synthetic rubber noodle. :rotf: :hmm: :thumbsup:

 

[Pete Gaimari]

Hickory for my gun.

Noodles for supper.

 

[BrownBear]

I plan to make a removable T-handle for the rod tomorrow and see if that works. It certainly does for the seating rod.

That will be dandy for pulling the rod, as in using a ball puller, but about the last thing you'll want to use for seating, whether a synthetic rod or hickory.

Zonie and some of the others mentioned grabbing the rod about 8" up and seating hand-over-hand in a series of shorter strokes, or some such. It hits a big fat nail right on the head.

 

[roundball]

Personal choice, I don't like fiddling around with a ramrod and seating a ball in increments...I use strong rigid ramrods and range rods, and seat them in one power stroke.

If you're married to the notion of a wooden under-barrel rod, then you'll need to either need to get a stiff wooden rod, and/or use a looser PRB combo (IMO, a smaller ball & thicker patch work best for that) and/or seat tight PRBs in short increments

 

[Pete Gaimari]

Or not be a girly man with no grip.

 

[Josh Smith]

Thanks Everyone.

This is a CVA Bobcat and though I've been looking for a wooden stock for it (I like the rifle overall), no joy. Someone here found one for me on Gunbroker, but the system is insisting that, even though I'm no longer a seller, I must have a credit card on file to bid or contact the seller. Ridiculous, as I don't believe in credit cards (a debit card wouldn't work!) and I'm pretty sure my identity was stolen by using a debit card on an improperly secured internet transaction.

Anyway, as it stands right now, a hickory ramrod would be a whole lot like dressing a sow up in a jewelry and a dress and taking it out for a night on the town. Just wouldn't look right.

It'll get ALL wood when I can find it.

I'm looking at switching fields again as I'm very close to being poor now - laid off too long - and went to get my teacher's license back today. Just got back, in fact.

I'm sure they thought I was stoned as I'd forgotten to eat breakfast (common with me when I know I have something to do) and the coffee and allergy meds hadn't kicked in yet. So I couldn't think and my eyelids were droopy! Aarrrgh. I know my background check will come back clean anyway as I've not even had a traffic violation within the past five or seven years, and it's clean enough, anyway, for a lifetime handgun carry permit and a CNA license.

OK, still waiting for that coffee to kick in! I'm ramblin'.

Point is, when this income starts up again, I'll be buying a new rifle, then looking at getting some wood for this one, even if the wood costs more than the rifle did.

Thanks,

Josh

 

[Josh Smith]

Or not be a girly man with no grip.

Hey! I'm just learning to live with arthritis! First year it really kicked up - I'm 33, gettin' old! :grin:

Josh

 

[Pete Gaimari]

Always look who a poster is responding to.

 

[Pete Gaimari]

Thanks Everyone.

This is a CVA Bobcat and though I've been looking for a wooden stock for it (I like the rifle overall), no joy. Someone here found one for me on Gunbroker, but the system is insisting that, even though I'm no longer a seller, I must have a credit card on file to bid or contact the seller. Ridiculous, as I don't believe in credit cards (a debit card wouldn't work!) and I'm pretty sure my identity was stolen by using a debit card on an improperly secured internet transaction.

Anyway, as it stands right now, a hickory ramrod would be a whole lot like dressing a sow up in a jewelry and a dress and taking it out for a night on the town. Just wouldn't look right.

It'll get ALL wood when I can find it.

I'm looking at switching fields again as I'm very close to being poor now - laid off too long - and went to get my teacher's license back today. Just got back, in fact.

I'm sure they thought I was stoned as I'd forgotten to eat breakfast (common with me when I know I have something to do) and the coffee and allergy meds hadn't kicked in yet. So I couldn't think and my eyelids were droopy! Aarrrgh. I know my background check will come back clean anyway as I've not even had a traffic violation within the past five or seven years, and it's clean enough, anyway, for a lifetime handgun carry permit and a CNA license.

OK, still waiting for that coffee to kick in! I'm ramblin'.

Point is, when this income starts up again, I'll be buying a new rifle, then looking at getting some wood for this one, even if the wood costs more than the rifle did.

Thanks,

Josh

Hickory ramrods are cheap and look normal on all ML. Look to Dixie.

 

[Josh Smith]

Hi Pete, Everyone,

I went ahead and just switched back to the .010" material.

Even though it burns or cuts or whatnot, it is accurate it seems.

And I'm getting cuts on this .015" to .022" stuff anyway. It is too thick. Really need to get out and find some in-between stuff. Walmart doesn't seem to have anything sufficiently tight and in-between.

Anyway, I increased the powder charge from 50 to 70gns. I said screw the paper targets, so standing I nailed a coffee can three out of five times - and those two times I missed, I knew I blew the shot. The coffee can was about half the size of a small deer's vitals.

Still not sure if I'm going to go deer hunting this year, but that's mainly because I don't have anyplace to put the meat.

I'm still getting to know this rifle, and it's a fun process.

Josh