shot cups

[crmyers]

Anyone have directions for making paper shot cups? I know its been on here before but I can't find it.

 

[roundball]

Anyone have directions for making paper shot cups? I know its been on here before but I can't find it.

Here's one way:

Taking some ideas from other posters and articles over the years, I experimented around and settled on the following for paper shot cups for long range tight pattern shot loads in a .62cal/.20ga smoothbore:

1. Post-it note papers with their particular thickness and self-adhering edge worked best;

2. I used a 6" long piece of 1/2" dowel with about 7 wraps of thick clear scotch packing tape around it to produce a paper cup diameter that is CLOSE BUT NOT TOUCHING the sides of a .62cal bore;

3. I roll / wrap the entire post-it note around the dowel on a hard flat surface starting with the dry edge so the tacky edge comes last and is used to stick it to the rolled paper, holding it together;

4. The size of the dowel needs to be built up enough so a post-it note stops short enough of going completely around twice so there is still a narrow (1/8"-1/4" wide) strip of single thickness paper which aids in bursting at set-back time;

5. Then I slide the tube off the dowel about 1/2" and fold in the end of the tube as you would a coin wrapper;

6. While still on the dowel, press the folds hard down onto a hard surface to crease the folds good and tight;

7. I pull the paper tube the rest of the way off the dowel...at this point it will be too long to use;

8. Measure the amount of shot you plan to use and pour it into the shot cup;

9. Mark the paper NO TALLER than the height of the shot you just poured in;

10. Pour out the shot and use scissors to cut off the excess paper at the mark;

11. Pour the shot back into the cup to test it...the paper should not extend above the shot;

12. The resultant cup diameter is a close to friction fit in the bore, with about .020" clearance around the tube;

13. The shot cup protects & holds the shot charge together until the instant it leaves the bore;

14. Upon exiting the bore, the paper opens and disintegrates, fluttering to the ground 5-10 feet from the muzzle;

Flintlock load results:

70grns Goex FFFg
Two (or three) .62cal/.20ga OxYoke prelubed wonder wads over the powder
Paper shot cup
1 & 5/8 oz #6's
One .030" thick .62cal/.20ga overshot card

I seat the first wonderwad down on the powder and compress the charge as I normally would;

Set the next wads down the bore a couple inches;
Slide the shot cup down on it and pour in the shot;

Install the OS card and GENTLY seat the whole thing, being careful not to crush and burst the cup prematurely by applying too much pressure **.

(** This is just my opinion not to prematurely burst the cup, it's not based on any science...BUT, so far, mine have worked fine.

30 yards = the whole pattern was contained in 22";
30 yards = 29 #6 pellets in a 4" x 5" target;
30 yards = 11 pellets into a coke can which is only a small 2.5" X 5" target;
40 yards = 8 pellets into a coke can (2.5" X 5");

Takes much longer to tell it than it does to do it once you get set up...

 

[crmyers]

Thanks, That sounds like it should work just fine. :thumbsup:

 

[29caliber]

This is the kind of information I've been looking for to get ready for turkey season. I've got a 20 gauge and 12 gauge to work out loads for and this is great information to start with. Thanks, Tom

 

[roundball]

This is the kind of information I've been looking for to get ready for turkey season. I've got a 20 gauge and 12 gauge to work out loads for and this is great information to start with. Thanks, Tom

Yes, once you grasp the concept just adjust accdordingly for caliber.

The only tricky part about making home made shot paper shot cups is that they MUST be allowed room to burst...otherwise you'll occasionally have a "slug" go all the way forward through the target if the paper doesn't burst and disintegrate right after muzzle exit.

So be sure to leave a good wide strip of single paper thickness when rolling it around the dowel the second wrap...and, if you come up with some easier/better tips to improve on my description, please post back so we can review/update our files...this whole thing is sort of a work-in-progress.
:thumbsup:

 

[DrTimboone]

Ok, That makes sense!! Now, have you ever tried leaving the paper a little longer and preloading the cups and then folding the tops over to keep the shot from falling ot and to give you something to grab hold of to pull a cup out of a cartrige box sort of arrangement??

Seems like it wwould work... but I sure don't want slugs going down range.

 

[roundball]

Ok, That makes sense!! Now, have you ever tried leaving the paper a little longer and preloading the cups and then folding the tops over to keep the shot from falling ot and to give you something to grab hold of to pull a cup out of a cartrige box sort of arrangement??

Seems like it wwould work... but I sure don't want slugs going down range.

I never tried it that way...always thought it might contribute to that 'slug' result...decided I didn't want the paper walls any higher than the shot was stacked and I then seated the OS card on top.
But it would be great if there was some way to do that and still get the burst/separation at muzzle exit that's needed...maybe you can experiment and come up with that as the next advancement to this whole undertaking. :grin:

 

[paulvallandigham]

folding the sides over the top of the shot is the fastest way to produce a " slug " I experienced so far. Trim the cup to length of the shot charge you put in it. Use an over shot card, or two to keep the shot in place.

 

[Hoyt]

folding the sides over the top of the shot is the fastest way to produce a " slug " I experienced so far. Trim the cup to length of the shot charge you put in it. Use an over shot card, or two to keep the shot in place.

I agree..and from my experience with the post-it note paper shot cups there's a very fine line between a dang good pattern and a slug. I found if I left the paper about 3/16" or so past the shot I got my best pattern at about 35yds. I think it just takes a hair longer to tear the paper loose after the cup leaves the barrel. However..I gambled and lost on one gobbler using that fine line method...no more. I'll cut the paper even with the shot or no paper cups at all.

 

[roundball]

I gambled and lost on one gobbler using that fine line method...no more. I'll cut the paper even with the shot or no paper cups at all.

And as good as they work when they work, the constant worry that I'd get the 1 out of 10 slug effect on a Tom after all the work to even get one in range and that was what finally pushed me over the top...I had a gunsmith in Iowa Jug Choke my .62cal soothbore...$60 (a handful of cheesburgers)...no more worries...averages 16 #6's in a 5" circle at 40yds.

 

[Hoyt]

I gambled and lost on one gobbler using that fine line method...no more. I'll cut the paper even with the shot or no paper cups at all.

And as good as they work when they work, the constant worry that I'd get the 1 out of 10 slug effect on a Tom after all the work to even get one in range and that was what finally pushed me over the top...I had a gunsmith in Iowa Jug Choke my .62cal soothbore...$60 (a handful of cheesburgers)...no more worries...averages 16 #6's in a 5" circle at 40yds.

I was going to go that route..was going to use the same guy you did..but I didn't want to have to take the lugs and sight off my barrel and replace them. So..I decided to build another smoothbore just for gobblers and send the barrel to Iowa to get jug choked before I got lugs, sights on it. I called Colerain to order the barrel..16ga...however, Scott at Colerain talked me into one of their .62cal.Turkey Barrels instead. It goes from .62cal. to .58cal. right at the muzzle. He says they are killing turkeys with them out to 45yds. and recommended front and rear sights the pattern is so tight. I just want a good pattern out to 35yds and it's almost impossible with cylinder bore. So will see when I get this one done.

 

[roundball]

Sort of like a "back-bored" .58.

The concept is interesting...modern trap shotguns have been backbored for decades...my Remington 1187 Trap is back bored from the chamber all the way to the choke threads.

The backbore effect is so real that the three chokes that come with the 1187 Trap gun, while labeled Full, Extra Full, and Super Full...are actually the basic set of Imp Cyl, Mod, and Full choke tubes relabeled...they mic that way and when I called Remington's Service Manager, he verified that's what they were.

Once I connected the dots, I understood how the jug choke works.

Interesting initiative on the part of Colerain to offer a backbored barrel for muzzleloaders...FWIW, Knight even made one several years ago as a switch barrel for one of their MLs...don't know if they still do or not.

 

folding the sides over the top of the shot is the fastest way to produce a " slug " I experienced so far. Trim the cup to length of the shot charge you put in it. Use an over shot card, or two to keep the shot in place.

yep...even worse if you glue it! A friend was experimenting in my backyard with his "shot cups" which he used a glue stick on (base and top) and they either burst or held together all the way to the target [making a rectangular hole off center as the paper 'bullet' cartwheeled into it]. He never could get a dense pattern at 40 yds (he was trying for a turkey load)--but part of the problem was his small bore [.50]. I use a glue stick for the base of the cup, but leave the top open.

 

[paulvallandigham]

;Hoyt: Use scissors to cut for slots in the top of that paper shot cup, to creat " petals" that will open up and act as an air brake. That will insure separation of the shot from the cup, but it will occur further in front of the barrel , giving you better patterns. I was at the stage of testing how long the cuts had to be to get the choke I wanted when I stopped the testing because of medical problems. I swear I am going to finish them this Spring. It won't be in time for the Spring Turkey Season, here, but maybe in time to use them on Pheasants next Fall.