Simple Caliber Question

[markb57]

Hi All - First time post from a newbie. Ages ago I assembled a "New Orleans Ace" piston, which I never shot. I would like to do so now, but need help on purchasing ball size. I don't have the original paperwork, but I see a similar kit on the 'net that says it is 44 caliber. When I mike the ID, it measures .436" to .438". I found one source that says 44 cal balls measure .430" but this doesn't leave much room for patch, does it? So my question - what cal ball should I buy? Or maybe I need to choose ball and patch together? Thanks for any help offfered!
markb

 

[arcticap]

Track of the Wolf sells balls measuring .410, .424, .429 & .433.
http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/newpost.php?fid/19/tid/252548/pid/926233/type/reply/


Since the barrel is smooth and not rifled, there aren't any grooves to hold excess patch material after the bore becomes fouled from the first several shots. A true .430 ball with the thinnest .005 patch may fit at first, but maybe not for many shots without swabbing. And then there's the question about whether it's a true .430 ball at all, but rather is a .433 ball or a .429 ball instead.
Smooth bore shooters often opt for a ball that's .015 - .020 smaller than bore diameter for easier loading with a slightly thicker patch. That way the patch has more room to compress when being loaded into the bore.
A .424 ball and a .007 patch might be just about right but that .007 patch will be hard to find. Using it with a .010 patch will require .005 of patch compression which will require experimentation to see if that's too tight or not.
The .410 ball would necessitate using a lubed .015 patch and may fit just about right with only .002 - .004 of patch compression needed. It's hard to say if that's the best choice, but the thicker patch will be easier to compress than a thinner one with a larger ball. Trying to achieve good accuracy with that pistol probably won't be much of an issue no matter which combination of ball and patch is chosen. So based on your measurement I would probably try out either the .410 ball with a lubed .015 patch, or a .429 ball with a .005 patch. If the .015 patch were too loose, then a .0018 patch could be tried with it next. However a .005 patch won't compress much at all and who knows how loose the bore measurement is at the breech end.
If any ball/patch combo. is too loose, then a homemade over powder card or newspaper wad can always be compressed on top of it to hold it in place in the breech and on top of the powder.
Even a loose fitting bare ball can be sandwiched in between 2 wads and fired safely if held in placed on top of the powder.
Good luck and let us know how it loads and shoots once you make the choice.

 

[nkbj]

How about a .420" and thick patch? Blue jean or canvas type.

 

[Don]

I shoot mine with a .433 ball and a .015 or .020 patch and have no problem seating the ball. I use the thicker patch when I want better velocity but it still isn't hard to seat the ball. I usually use 20 grains of pyrodex p for a load.

Don

 

[napolean]

Hi Markb
Welcome to the forum!
As I value all forum members, A word of caution to all Ace owners.
Remove the barrel from that Ace, and check how far the threading at the breech extends into the barrel. On the one I have the cotton pickin threads were about 1¾" into the barrel. With a 15 grain load the ball was still seated in the threaded section as only about ½" is used to attach the barrel to the breech. A machinist buddy of mine made me a new barrel.
IMO, this could be at best a cleaning headache,
at worst, unsafe.
Jon D

 

[CoyoteJoe]

As you see, it may be a simple question but there are no simple answers! :haha:

 

[Zonie]

A barrel with threads running up the bore would not be unsafe to shoot as long as there are enough breech threads screwed into it but, as you said, cleaning the fouling out of the breech could be a chore.

Unfortunatly, that sort of thing is typical of the guns and gun kits made by Classic Arms, U.S.A. :shake:

 

[markb57]

Hi Everyone,

What great forum! Thanks to all for the tips and thoughts. This probably won't happen until January, but I'll order the balls and let one of the kids give them to me for Christmas. I have some patch from a "starter kit" I got with the Ace, so I will mike for thickness and pick a ball size to give a mild compression. And thanks for the warning on the threads. I will check where the ball will seat and see if it seems safe.

Thanks again to all,
markb

 

[napolean]

Have fun when you get to shoot it. The caution I mention is to be sure the ball is seated on the powder and not just stuck on the threads. Find yourself a better loading stick (a piece of 3/8" dowel will work) than the little brass one that came with the gun and make a mark on it where you know that the ball is seated right.
10 to 15 grains of 3F is plenty for this type of pistola.
Jon D

 

[markb57]

Thanks all...

I just checked the old box with my "starter kit". It included a package of .015 lubed patches, so I'll order some .410 balls. It also has a nice ball starter with a big round wooden ball to start the bullet and a wooden ramrod much longer than the brass one on the Ace.

Thanks again,
markb