I am looking for advise on finishing the decorative carving on my stock. What can be used to smooth the bottom of the insized an relief cuts, as the stripe tends to go alternately hard and soft, thus the bottom of the cuts is not even. Any tools or ideas will be greatly appreciated.
stock carving
- Thread starter bjohnston
- Start date
Help Support Muzzleloading Forum:
Small scrapers. You can make them from old saw blades. There are also curved riffler files, or home-made tiny sanding blocks.
If you need to get into a small place with some accuracy, then find an old oil level check thingy (what is it's dang name anyway?)... you can cut up a bunch of 2-3" long scrapers from one of these. Square the end, turn a burr and you're good to go. The size makes it easy to hold and manipulate.
Another handy tool is a x-acto pen knife. Very thin narrow blade, use as a scraper.
Take your time, go slow with a light touch.
vic
If you need to get into a small place with some accuracy, then find an old oil level check thingy (what is it's dang name anyway?)... you can cut up a bunch of 2-3" long scrapers from one of these. Square the end, turn a burr and you're good to go. The size makes it easy to hold and manipulate.
Another handy tool is a x-acto pen knife. Very thin narrow blade, use as a scraper.
Take your time, go slow with a light touch.
vic
The pen sized knife might be in hobby shops. I got mine for cutting silk screen material. Art supply stores would be the best place to look for it. It was an expensive little begger, tho- about $5 or 10 when I got it 25 years ago.
vic
vic
Guest
Dip-stick, Vic, Dip-stick. No, You're not one, that's what you were trying to think of, and thanks for the idea, I'm getting to where I was going to ask the samee question you answered. Bill
You will need lots of various lil scrapers to keep the carvings & etc. smoothed out. One thing you can make some from is a cheap set of carving tools. You can get them at the hobby shop or Walmart or flea market places. (usually sets of 5-10 tools) Take a pair of pliers & pull the metal blades out. Now take a torch & heat the lil blade & bend it about 90 degrees & then drop it in a cup of oil to quench it. Clean the oil off well with brake drum cleaner or acetone & then grind a couple lil notches in the tang where it goes back into the wood, put some Devcon Epoxy (Walmart) in the hole & shove the tang back in it. This set will make ya about 5-10 lil scrapers of various sizes & shapes to get into the nooks & crannies of the carvings. Old screwdrivers with heated & bent tips work well also. Broken glass works well, etc.
If you want a superb set of carving tools, I recomment the FlexCut brand and you can get them at WoodCrafts. I can carve 3-4 rifles & not have to sharpen them & to me that is a fabulous tool to withstand that much work & not need sharpened.
:results:
If you want a superb set of carving tools, I recomment the FlexCut brand and you can get them at WoodCrafts. I can carve 3-4 rifles & not have to sharpen them & to me that is a fabulous tool to withstand that much work & not need sharpened.
:results:
Why doesn't anyone ever talk about sharpening :curse: Well ok birddog talked about sharpening a little, but not enough for me.
This drives me crazy..Your going to have problems carving if you don't sharpen your chisels. You could go out and buy 10 high dollar (45.00) each chisels and within a couple of hours when they are dull your gonna start "mashing" the wood grain and its gonna look like crap. The reason your having problems is your chisel is cutting the soft grain and bouncing over the hard grain.
I don't recall you asking for a cheap solution to carving so my suggestion will not be cheap. Invest in good quality chisels. Get yourself a power strop ($20.00) which is a leather barrel that mounts in your drill press and a tube of stropping abrasive.
When you really get the hang of it invest in a nice water cooled sharpening system. The better sharpening method you pick the more time you can spend carving instead of sharpening.
All in all I spend 50% of my time sharpening then 50% carving.
Did I mention the value of sharpening? Sharpen sharpen sharpen.
eace:
This drives me crazy..Your going to have problems carving if you don't sharpen your chisels. You could go out and buy 10 high dollar (45.00) each chisels and within a couple of hours when they are dull your gonna start "mashing" the wood grain and its gonna look like crap. The reason your having problems is your chisel is cutting the soft grain and bouncing over the hard grain.
I don't recall you asking for a cheap solution to carving so my suggestion will not be cheap. Invest in good quality chisels. Get yourself a power strop ($20.00) which is a leather barrel that mounts in your drill press and a tube of stropping abrasive.
When you really get the hang of it invest in a nice water cooled sharpening system. The better sharpening method you pick the more time you can spend carving instead of sharpening.
All in all I spend 50% of my time sharpening then 50% carving.
Did I mention the value of sharpening? Sharpen sharpen sharpen.
eace:Bill, whadya mean by a dip-stick? Break it off, sharpen one side? never heard of that, but sounds interesting...I just might look into tryin' that......yer gonna have to explain a little more on that subject for me to get a full understanding.
I apologize for the poor spelling and such...I was reading a post by Rollingb and....well, gosh, it just sort of took hold of me...starting to spell like he does now!
Guest
Well, we were talking about using a scraper in small tight areas, an old junkyard cars dipstick was recommended, as tool steel to make custom scrapers., and yes rootnuke, when using chisels sharpening is next to godliness, they can never be sharp enough. It's amazing how fast a chisel, or gouge will dull or burr up when working on maple. They don't always need stone, but will always need a strop. Mine is the backside of an old belt, and I use Jewelers rouge. Another thing for the people using exacto knifes, is to change those blades often, especially if using them to outline inlays. Last but not least is do not sand until you are done with your edged tools, sanding will leave fine grit in the wood pores, an dull your blades almost instantly :imo: Bill
Agree totally on the sharpening. No amount of cleaning up carving done with a less than sharp tool will make it look as good as cleanly cut carving. It took me a while to learn what "sharp" is. I thought I knew, but I was mistaken.
Another things is tool design. The angles of the edges, clearance, lots of things. Most tools are made for general purposes and to withstand someone using a ball-peen hammer to drive it with a twisting motion into some osage orange. The maker knows if it breaks, the customer is going to be unhappy whether or not he/she was using it properly.
I usually forge my own chisels from O1 drill rod or re-work old ones, making the angle of the cutting edge more acute, good and square, and relieving the sides a bit (so the chisel is a little narrower in width at the top of the bevel than at the edge).
once shaped properly and stones sharp, the strop and rouge will really make them sharp. An old flat leather belt will work as a strop. Power systems etc are nice but old mthods will work too.
Another things is tool design. The angles of the edges, clearance, lots of things. Most tools are made for general purposes and to withstand someone using a ball-peen hammer to drive it with a twisting motion into some osage orange. The maker knows if it breaks, the customer is going to be unhappy whether or not he/she was using it properly.
I usually forge my own chisels from O1 drill rod or re-work old ones, making the angle of the cutting edge more acute, good and square, and relieving the sides a bit (so the chisel is a little narrower in width at the top of the bevel than at the edge).
once shaped properly and stones sharp, the strop and rouge will really make them sharp. An old flat leather belt will work as a strop. Power systems etc are nice but old mthods will work too.
Go buy yerself some emery boards; the kind used to smooth finger nails..
One side is course, the other side is fine..
Take a pair of sissors; and cut to the shape you want..
These can get into very small spaces, and level areas off by sanding..
Hope that helps ya !!!
Winter well
limpin'frog :results: :applause: :applause:
One side is course, the other side is fine..
Take a pair of sissors; and cut to the shape you want..
These can get into very small spaces, and level areas off by sanding..
Hope that helps ya !!!
Winter well
limpin'frog :results: :applause: :applause:
Next garage sale, buy up several different sizes of small allen wrenchs for a couple of bucks.(or a quarter) They are fine steel, just grind to shape, (keep cool with water) install in wood dowel handles, and you have a great set of scrapers on the cheap
I made my set up over 30 years a go, with all the honing & scraping, they haven't wore out yet.
I made my set up over 30 years a go, with all the honing & scraping, they haven't wore out yet.
Rootnuke: Keep in mind that everyone does this different & I know of no set rules on Chisels, Scrapers, etc.
IMHO, if the tool is made of good quality tool steel it will simply seldom need sharpening. The FlexCut brand are made of spring steel, very hard & I sharpen mine on a tri-stone sharpener that has Arkansas Oil Stones on it.
As I said, I sharpen them about every 3-4 rifles. They hold a razor edge forever it seems, that is IF you don't hit any metal with them. As with any tool, once ya hit metal on that razor edge, you will have to sharpen them.
I have made allot of other tools & scrapers & some do well, some were not so well. Small old wood chisels made a pretty good scraper. When I heat them I put a heat block paste on the tip, heat them & then quench them in motor oil, so the temper is not messed up on the tips. For tiny scrapers like used to scrape out the slot for the underlugs, as small needle file or small chainsaw file makes a good one. One must take care as not to overheat the end when forming it & not take all the carbon out. If it gets bright red & starts sparking, you just went one step too hot and took the carbon out of the steel.
But it you have to sharpen the tool all the time either the tool is not good steel, improperly hardened, or you are sharpening it wrong. Most carving tools & wood chisels & scrapers, you sharpen on One Side & you leave the other side untouched. The cheap carving tools will get you by at the very least. When you get a good set of carving tools you will appreciate them & make scrapers from the cheap ones. Buy one good FlexCut carving tool a year & in 5 years you will have all of them you really need. (WoodCrafts) The main carving tool you need is the "V" tool.......... You can inlet & carve half a rifle with a "V" tool alone.. Then a couple half round tools of dif sizes & you can really go to town. That and a set of the 5 Nickolson small fiwood files & you are on your way to making a rifle.... I probably have at least 4 sets of carving tools I have bought.... Looking back, if I did it all over again I would just buy the FlexCut as the others sit there & do nothing... Yes the FlexCut cost more money, but I have allot more $ in the other sets combined & I never use the others. I will most likely end up making scrapers from all of the other ones eventually......
As for chisels, I seldom use a chisel on a rifle. I prefer to use band saw, a wood rasps, belt sander & carving tools to cut mine out when making one from a blank. About the only time I use a chisel is when inletting the barrel at the breech & the base of the tang as it is tough cutting straight down & cross grain.
:results:
IMHO, if the tool is made of good quality tool steel it will simply seldom need sharpening. The FlexCut brand are made of spring steel, very hard & I sharpen mine on a tri-stone sharpener that has Arkansas Oil Stones on it.
As I said, I sharpen them about every 3-4 rifles. They hold a razor edge forever it seems, that is IF you don't hit any metal with them. As with any tool, once ya hit metal on that razor edge, you will have to sharpen them.
I have made allot of other tools & scrapers & some do well, some were not so well. Small old wood chisels made a pretty good scraper. When I heat them I put a heat block paste on the tip, heat them & then quench them in motor oil, so the temper is not messed up on the tips. For tiny scrapers like used to scrape out the slot for the underlugs, as small needle file or small chainsaw file makes a good one. One must take care as not to overheat the end when forming it & not take all the carbon out. If it gets bright red & starts sparking, you just went one step too hot and took the carbon out of the steel.
But it you have to sharpen the tool all the time either the tool is not good steel, improperly hardened, or you are sharpening it wrong. Most carving tools & wood chisels & scrapers, you sharpen on One Side & you leave the other side untouched. The cheap carving tools will get you by at the very least. When you get a good set of carving tools you will appreciate them & make scrapers from the cheap ones. Buy one good FlexCut carving tool a year & in 5 years you will have all of them you really need. (WoodCrafts) The main carving tool you need is the "V" tool.......... You can inlet & carve half a rifle with a "V" tool alone.. Then a couple half round tools of dif sizes & you can really go to town. That and a set of the 5 Nickolson small fiwood files & you are on your way to making a rifle.... I probably have at least 4 sets of carving tools I have bought.... Looking back, if I did it all over again I would just buy the FlexCut as the others sit there & do nothing... Yes the FlexCut cost more money, but I have allot more $ in the other sets combined & I never use the others. I will most likely end up making scrapers from all of the other ones eventually......
As for chisels, I seldom use a chisel on a rifle. I prefer to use band saw, a wood rasps, belt sander & carving tools to cut mine out when making one from a blank. About the only time I use a chisel is when inletting the barrel at the breech & the base of the tang as it is tough cutting straight down & cross grain.
:results:
You could also check out Woodcarvers supply. They have an interesting set of scrapers, looks like the handle of a shaving razor with different shaped razor blades that attach to it with a screw.
They also sell rifflers, all sizes, both tool steel and diamond.
I just bought a woodcarvers felt power wheel, it is shaped to strop gouges, V tools and flat chisels. I haven't tried it yet but it looks good.
I also bought two flexcuts, a V tool and a skew chisel. They are cheaper than the high end chisels but I was very impressed with them. Razor sharp and stiffer than what I expected. I will definetly buy some more.
When buying chisels look for a Rockwell hardness of 60 to 62 C. Once these are sharp they won't require sharpening as often. I have a few of the Acorn brand and a couple of Henry Taylor, both from Woodcarvers. The Acorn brand is a little cheaper but seem to be just as good as the other.
If a person has problems sharpening chisels then a Veritas jig could be your answer. It establishes the proper angle and doesn't allow you to mess things up like we sometimes do (often) when freehanding. It could be $40. well spent.
They also sell rifflers, all sizes, both tool steel and diamond.
I just bought a woodcarvers felt power wheel, it is shaped to strop gouges, V tools and flat chisels. I haven't tried it yet but it looks good.
I also bought two flexcuts, a V tool and a skew chisel. They are cheaper than the high end chisels but I was very impressed with them. Razor sharp and stiffer than what I expected. I will definetly buy some more.
When buying chisels look for a Rockwell hardness of 60 to 62 C. Once these are sharp they won't require sharpening as often. I have a few of the Acorn brand and a couple of Henry Taylor, both from Woodcarvers. The Acorn brand is a little cheaper but seem to be just as good as the other.
If a person has problems sharpening chisels then a Veritas jig could be your answer. It establishes the proper angle and doesn't allow you to mess things up like we sometimes do (often) when freehanding. It could be $40. well spent.
I use the words carving tools, carving chisels and chisels interchangeably. Which, is probably wrong. But nevertheless I do sharpen alot. But to be clear, when I sharpen that does not mean I use a stone and grind. I mean sharpen as in stropping leather to remove the microscopic metal. This gives me the razor edge I need to compensate for my lack of talent.
Believe me, those Swiss made PFIEL chisels, darn I did it again (carving sets) are not cheap and I'm not going to grind away at a perfect factory edge.
Any time I could not get the carving right it was a result of a dull blade and as a result the wood was working me instead of me working the wood. :redthumb:
Here is something that we can also agree on. The first rule of carving tools, when you drop them they always fall on their point. Isn't that nice.
Similar threads
