Swaged or Run Balls?

[Halftail]

Which do you think better?I saw the thread going on swaged balls and was wondering how many here Buy theirs Swaged and how many run their own?I have been running my own lead for years with a lee mold But I'm not to high-tech,I just use an old fry-pan and Coleman stove to melt my lead in.
If I was a really serious shooter I get a scale and weigh and cull my balls out accordingly and shoot only certain weights.Running ball the way I do the weights vary,sometimes 7 or 8 grains either way.When things go right it can be only a grain or two out of the way.
Do swaged balls have a more uniformed weight?

 

[jtmattison]

I run my own ball and have weighed them to check consistency. Mine are almost all the exact weight and if they are off it is only a few 1/10ths of a grain. I have never weighed swaged balls but I assume they are very consistent.
For the price (free lead) I will make my own. They shoot great and I get the satisfaction of using something I made myself.

HD

 

[2172]

back when I bought balls, I always bought swagged. I've been running my own for a few years now, and weigh them. I see no difference in performance between them. I should add I only shoot offhand, so maybe I would see a difference if I shot off the bench..Hank

 

[Jon in MI]

I buy the swaged .54's because I can and am running my own for .600 because I can't buy them swaged.

Jon

 

[jimeckersley]

Which do you think better? ...If I was a really serious shooter I get a scale and weigh and cull my balls out accordingly and shoot only certain weights.Running ball the way I do the weights vary,sometimes 7 or 8 grains either way. ...
Do swaged balls have a more uniformed weight?

Since I use both cast and swaged, I can't say that one is better than the other. For my use though, I "blue print" both types.

Are the swaged balls more uniform in weight? Well, if you just weigh 50 swaged balls right out of the box and 50 balls that were just cast, most would agree that there would be more weight variation in the freshly cast balls. But the cast balls cost a lot less to make and I don't mind returning the light ones to the pot, or giving them to my buddies. The cast balls that I end up using are equal to the swaged ball used because of weighing them, and so forth.

 

[Swampman]

It doesn't really matter, because the weight won't really affect the way they shoot. The culls will shoot just as good as the ones you weigh and sort. The swaged will shoot just as well as the cast and vice versa.

 

[Halftail]

It doesn't really matter, because the weight won't really affect the way they shoot. The culls will shoot just as good as the ones you weigh and sort. The swaged will shoot just as well as the cast and vice versa.

Nope,
Your wrong.

 

I cast my own and have for years. But in a pinch I'll buy swaged balls to figure out what size mold to buy for a new rifle. I like my cast ones better. Satisfaction guaranteed. If I don't like them I throw them back. :grin:
Don

 

[jtmattison]

It doesn't really matter, because the weight won't really affect the way they shoot. The culls will shoot just as good as the ones you weigh and sort. The swaged will shoot just as well as the cast and vice versa.

Nope,
Your wrong.

I agree.
I have fired wrinkled and underweight balls and found a measurable difference in accuracy.

HD

 

[jimeckersley]

It doesn't really matter, because the weight won't really affect the way they shoot. The culls will shoot just as good as the ones you weigh and sort. The swaged will shoot just as well as the cast and vice versa.

Nope,
Your wrong.

It's remarkable isn't it Halftail, how nearly every competitive shooter in this country, or any other country for that matter, is wrong and swampman is right. Oh well. :hmm:

 

[Swampman]

You think it makes a difference, but it doesn't. The culls will shoot right there with the perfect ones. I've seen it done to many times. Keep wasting your time, if it makes you feel better. I'd rather shoot. Target shooters have drug so much modern thinking into the hobby...... :snore:

 

[Zonie]

Several years ago I read a post that said swaged balls were not consistant in weight.

Now, I'm fully aware of the swaging process and by rights, it should produce very consistant weights whether it is swaging round balls or pistol bullets.

With this in mind, I set out to prove the author of the post wrong by getting out seveal boxes of both Hornady and Speer balls and weighing them.

I was amazed! There was over 5 grains of variation between the round balls out of the same box! A few balls were over 8 grains off of the average (for .490 dia balls).
The brand name didn't make any difference either. The Hornady balls varied just like the Speer balls did.

As to how the weight variation effects accuracy, AIR, the Bevel Brothers did some testing on this subject and found there was less effect than most folks think.

After running my weighing test and reading the findings of the Bevel Brothers I decided that my old cast at home balls were going to shoot better than I could even with the 2-3 grain weight variation I sometimes get out of my Lee molds.

As for the target shooters weighing every ball and using only those which weigh within a few tenths of a grain for a match, I can understand that. They don't want to take any chanches whatsoever.
When 1/32 of an inch on a target can make the difference between winning and coming in second they want to do everything they can to reduce the group size.

 

[Stumpkiller]

Look at it this way. A ball fired from even a slow 1:66" twist is making 1,636 RPM as it spins. About the same as a hand drill at full speed. Ever hold a drill with the bit off center even a little bit? Doesn't take much to cause the ball to wobble.

Maybe not enough to bother some folks, but it would bother me. I weigh & visually inspect every ball I cast. Usually I do this whan I can't be out shooting or hunting, so there is no rush. I don't want the ball I happen to have loaded to be one with a huge void inside when Mr. Big walks along.

 

Me either, I weigh 'em and inspect them visually. If they are wrinkled or have a pin hole in the sprue or any imperfection I don't even weigh them. Into the pot they go.
I guess I don't mind wasting my time. :rotf:
Don

 

[Russianblood]

I cast for my 20 bore trade gun as a few imperfections in the ball would just be more historically correct. :hmm: Besides, .600 round balls are expensive and with a Lee mold and free lead, they are very cheap to cast.

I use Hornady swaged in my .54 Great Plains Rifle so I don't have to worry about imperfections.

 

[Zonie]

Boy Stumpy. I think you might have lost a decimal point there somewhere.

Acording to my cypherin, a 1:66 twist rotates the ball once every 5.5 feet.
If the muzzle velocity is 1500 Feet per second we have 1500 feet/second divided by 5.5 feet to find out how many times the ball spins per second.
That would be 1500/5.5 =272.7273 rev per second.
272.7273 X 60 seconds (in a minute) =16363.6364 RPM.

Just rattleing your chain :grin:

 

[Swampman]

Swaged balls have voids in them and the weight varies quite a bit. It doesn't really matter though. Read Mike Nessbit's recent article in Muzzleloader Magazine.

 

[Poor Boy]

:bull: Mike Nesbitt is a writer not a do'er.He writes here say.Air holes inside bullets(balls or conicles) will not be consistant.If you want to be a target shooter,be consistant in all components,and weigh your balls........OLSON

 

[oomcurt]

Since this thread is under "shooting accessories" and not "accuracy" I'll add my two cents. seems kinda strange that way back most folks ran thier own balls. I doubt if there were that many that bought swaged balls due to either thier location or financial situation. Yet, those folks managed to put meat on the table, engage in informal shooting sessions and kill thier enemies. Wonder how many of them weighed thier balls. I can just picture a long hunter or a Rocky Mountain Fur trapper hauling along a scale to weigh balls on..yeah, right. Now while I will concede that today's competition target shooters will want to go through all this rigamarole, that does not mean the rest of us want to.

 

[Stumpkiller]

Boy Stumpy. I think you might have lost a decimal point there somewhere.

Acording to my cypherin, a 1:66 twist rotates the ball once every 5.5 feet.
If the muzzle velocity is 1500 Feet per second we have 1500 feet/second divided by 5.5 feet to find out how many times the ball spins per second.
That would be 1500/5.5 =272.7273 rev per second.
272.7273 X 60 seconds (in a minute) =16363.6364 RPM.

Just rattleing your chain :grin:

DOH! My abacus has a bead missing. :redface: