TC Renegade Cock Geometry Adjustment

[dylan84]

Just got this rifle today. Doesn't appear to have ever been shot, but has the dreaded early model poor geometry lock. Even though I am completely new to flintlocks, I could tell it wasn't right as the flint was contacting the frizzen below the halfway point and was not even flipping the frizzen up out of the way. Tested it with powder in the pan numerous times in the shop and sometimes it wouldn't ignite.

Not being very patient and wanting to go out and shoot it reliably in the Kansas wind, I fired up the torch and got to work. I used a 1/2" piece of bar in the vise for the anvil as I needed to stretch the cock a little to gain some length out of it. I had to cool it about 4 times until I got the fitment right. It still might need a little tweaking with new flints. So far I have shot 3 live rounds and at least 7 pan flashes. No fails so far.

Just thought I would share my adjustments as the corrected parts are getting hard to find and expensive. If you have a torch and a hammer you can make the stock cock work. I thought about upgrading locks, but might run this for awhile to see how it works. Thanks to all the great information on here I was able to make this work better.

Both pictures are at half cock. As you can see the original is nowhere close to the frizzen!

 

[waarp8nt]

It will spark even better with some proper knapped flints, those T/C cut flints are not much on performance.

 

[dylan84]

It will spark even better with some proper knapped flints, those T/C cut flints are not much on performance.

Hoping to get some ordered this week. Already having a blast shooting this rifle. Shot 3 more times and one time it took two times to set it off. I think the black powder fouling gets to this flint pretty bad. Can't wait to try better ones. Was going to try the English flints from Track, but I am open to suggestions.

 

[waarp8nt]

Was going to try the English flints from Track, but I am open to suggestions.

I used to get my flints at a local muzzleloader show, however that has dried up. The last ones I ordered were from Track of the Wolf, but I have yet to use any of them.

A well functioning lock makes a flintlock so much fun to shoot. I nearly gave up on flintlocks after a poor functioning lock. Then I shot my Uncle's Dixie Tennessee Mountain Rifle and was hooked. I now have a few T/C flintlocks with various locks and a couple of custom rifles. Good on you for attempting to correct the lock geometry. Keep in mind The Gun Works Emporium has some parts and Lyman Frizzens can be made to fit T/C locks.

 

[waarp8nt]

Tried to edit my last post, but couldn't get the link to work. Here is a link to The Gun Works Emporium. According to Smith & Wesson, the last owners of T/C, they sold the Gun Works Emporium the last of their T/C parts.

https://www.thegunworks.com/custprodgun.cfm?CatID=2&ShowLevel=1

 

[dylan84]

Tried to edit my last post, but couldn't get the link to work. Here is a link to The Gun Works Emporium. According to Smith & Wesson, the last owners of T/C, they sold the Gun Works Emporium the last of their T/C parts.

https://www.thegunworks.com/custprodgun.cfm?CatID=2&ShowLevel=1

Ok thanks!

 

[waksupi]

If you start bending the cock on a flinter, you want to see to it that the edge of the flint points to the center of the pan in fired position. It appears if you would have had a proper flint, the original configuration would have worked okay.

When you don't know what you are doing, it is best to treat such projects as you would a sore pecker.

 

[dylan84]

If you start bending the cock on a flinter, you want to see to it that the edge of the flint points to the center of the pan in fired position. It appears if you would have had a proper flint, the original configuration would have worked okay.

When you don't know what you are doing, it is best to treat such projects as you would a sore pecker.

It works better but the flint ends up towards the front of the pan. The only way to really fix these locks is to move the cock pivot point back. I am planning to put a different lock on it at some point but I do have this gun shooting reliably now. Getting about 4-5 shots before I have to touch up the flint a little bit. From what I have read that is not too bad.

Originally it hit the frizzen below the halfway point making very little spark and hammering the manure out of flints. This is basically what their upgrade cock is doing. It is stretched out an angled back a little more. Still a band-aid on a very poor lock design.

 

[Danny Ross]

The above mentioned Web site (by waarp8nt) sells the newer hammer cock, that was from TC, for better geometry. A buddy of mine got one from there 1-2 years ago. They had a bunch of them left. They are sold in 3 parts if I remember right: the screw, the jaw I believe it is called that adjusts for the flint using the screw, and the hammer. I don't remember it being that much. DANNY

 

[good ole boy]

Some friends and I have Rennies and Hawkins with the original geometry lock some bought new decades ago with zero issues.That sayin our flints are not hitting way low on the frizzens either.

 

[rkrcpa]

I bought a new hammer for my Hawken flintlock last week for $25, received it in just a few days.

 

[dylan84]

Some friends and I have Rennies and Hawkins with the original geometry lock some bought new decades ago with zero issues.That sayin our flints are not hitting way low on the frizzens either.

Yeah I think after reading on this forum and others that there must have been some wide variance in locks and breech plugs on these renegades. I am liking mine pretty well now. Still plan on putting a better lock on it and using the doctored up old lock for a pistol build.

 

[dylan84]

I bought a new hammer for my Hawken flintlock last week for $25, received it in just a few days.

Did it work a lot better? Mine works pretty well now. Besides using a little O2, acetylene, and some leather, it was free to doctor my lock up. I really just wanted to learn and test what geometry works well in a lock. Still the only way to really fix it is to move the cock pivot point farther away. It lights off in the wind even now so I can live with it!

 

[brianpa40]

I put a L&R lock on mine and didn't look back. Well worth the price.

 

[RIDE-RED350R]

Tried to edit my last post, but couldn't get the link to work. Here is a link to The Gun Works Emporium. According to Smith & Wesson, the last owners of T/C, they sold the Gun Works Emporium the last of their T/C parts.

https://www.thegunworks.com/custprodgun.cfm?CatID=2&ShowLevel=1

Thanks for sharing. I just ordered the updated cock, screw, and jaw for my PA Hunter. Next up, the modified Lyman frizzen

 

[dylan84]

I put a L&R lock on mine and didn't look back. Well worth the price.

That's the plan! I also thought about one of those blank back plate locks from Chambers.

 

[RIDE-RED350R]

Parts showed up today

So I figure this might be appropriate to ask in this thread. I was looking up the modified Lyman frizzen and it's currently out of stock. Seems the unmodified Lyman frizzens aren't too hard to find right now. Can someone elaborate on how to modify the Lyman frizzen to work with the TC lock?

 

[dylan84]

Parts showed up today

So I figure this might be appropriate to ask in this thread. I was looking up the modified Lyman frizzen and it's currently out of stock. Seems the unmodified Lyman frizzens aren't too hard to find right now. Can someone elaborate on how to modify the Lyman frizzen to work with the TC lock?

I don't know but I was able to harden my frizzen and it works pretty decent. I used the old leather in a can trick and seemed to work! lol

 

[White Oak]

Have you checked on a new style TC frizzen from The Gun Works? TC not only changed their cock but also there is a new frizzen. The original was case hardened. The new style is coal black and I believe hardened through. I believe this frizzen is equal to the Lyman . If you go that route be sure to specify new style. The Gun Works quite possibly got both when they purchased TCs stock. Have you tried RMC Oxyoke for the altered Lyman frizzens? That is were I got mine several years ago. Just haven't had to use them yet.
Good Luck,
Ed

 

[RIDE-RED350R]

Have you checked on a new style TC frizzen from The Gun Works? TC not only changed their cock but also there is a new frizzen. The original was case hardened. The new style is coal black and I believe hardened through. I believe this frizzen is equal to the Lyman . If you go that route be sure to specify new style. The Gun Works quite possibly got both when they purchased TCs stock. Have you tried RMC Oxyoke for the altered Lyman frizzens? That is were I got mine several years ago. Just haven't had to use them yet.
Good Luck,
Ed

Ya know, when I ordered the new cock, jaw and screw I didn't even think to look at the frizzens as I wasn't aware TC improved the hardening of their frizzen as well. I did look up the Oxyoke frizzen but it's not in stock currently. That's what spurred my question as to how the Lyman frizzen is modified. If it's a little work with a file or a Foredom grinder I can handle that.

Think I'm going to swing back over to the Gun Works site and check out what they have. Thank you for the tip. .