TC Renegade with Rice Fast 1:24 .50 Barrell

[Okurok]

I've fell down a rabbit hole and it's going to be great. At the ALR forums, I stumbled across ALR member Curtis and his Rod England "Alexander Henry" kit build. Became very intrigued with the whole long range muzzleloader idea and fell in love with the aesthetics of that type of rifle. SO... started funding a Alex Henry build. Didn't look like its going to be one of those instant gratification things so meanwhile I came across Idahoron and Idaholewis posts about hot rod renegades. So thanks to these enablers I now own a Rice barreled TC Renegade. I've run down the sights I want and have everything I need except for the bullet mold. Which is not in stock. And I have a million questions that are going to be a joy to figure out once I get said mold and start interrogating the rifle at my range. Planning to take it elk hunting this season so am going to get familiar with it out to 300 yds. I'm also planning on practicing my checkering skills and pouring a pewter forend cap. Barrel also needs to be rust blued. I haven't been this excited about a new rifle in a while. What's ironic is that when I was 12 or so, my family stopped in the Bass Pro store in Springfield MO and I begged my dad to buy me a TC Renegade that was on special at an end display. He declined.

So I didn't want to take the other thread in more directions than it already had. I do have some questions though that some may be able to answer. Idaholewis mentioned he sizes the bullet to .501 and can start the bullet with thumb. I'm wondering if there is any danger in the bullet creeping forward while carrying rifle in the field. It's kinda painful to have a rifle you can't wait to shoot, plentiful supplies and no bullets. Another question is does anyone know of a supplier of a standing shooting stick that would appear somewhat traditional and not some plastic folding toy.

 

[Okurok]

 

[Okurok]

I was really impressed how tight the barrel fit both in the channel and the tang. I'm seriously considering exchanging the lock for a L&R RPL lock. OEM lock and triggers leave a lot to be desired. I'm going to examine them in a little more depth this weekend. After I reinstalled them after taking them to see what I was dealing with, I had to loosen up the lock plate to get the hammer to stay at full cock. It seemed that the trigger bar was hitting the sear. If I would set the trigger it would stay at full cock.

 

[Don Steele]

Congratulations on finding a niche that has caught your attention and pursuing that interest. I'm going to share some thoughts and apologize if I'm telling you things you already know, but I don't know what your experience level is so please bear with me.
This is quite coincidental to me, as I was discussing fast-twist "Drop-in" barrels for T/C rifles just last week with Jason ( Rice Barrels) at Friendship. He has been offering Rice Drop-in's for T/C's for a few years now, fully set-up with underlug, sights, etc., ready to apply your choice of finish and go to shooting. The ones I've seen have all the quality we expect from any of his products. Using one of those as a quick entry into long range muzzleloading looks like a heck of an idea.
As to bullet movement, you won't know until you have it all in hand. I've done some hunting with the 50 cal 385 gn Hornady hollow-base "Great Plains" bullet. They "load easy" and while cognizant of the possibility of bullet creep, I never experienced it. My hunting with that rifle has all been done from a stand and once I got in place I'd check the load, then sit still so the rifle wasn't getting jostled around or packed over the mountains. That's not to say it can't happen, you will just need to be aware of the potential and evaluate the likelihood once you have your bullet and load worked up.
The lock/trigger issues you describe appear at first blush to be a matter of "fitting" more than the overall quality of the parts. My own experience with T/C rifles has been excellent in the 45+ years that I've enjoyed them. I can tell you that based upon the experience of two friends...while the L&R replacement lock can be an option they aren't some kind of panacea. In those cases I know of they were certainly are not "drop-in". Fitting was required in both cases.
Long range shooting with blackpowder rifles is a fascinating discipline. In my case..when I lived out on the prairie (Nebraska) I got interested in BPCR (black powder cartridge rifles) and was constantly amazed at how accurate the old 45/70 could be with careful loading and a rifle/sight combination that would really "reach out and touch" those targets. Loading a big bullet from the muzzle in front of a large charge of powder will absolutely be a blast ( see what I did there..??!) with equally impressive results. ENJOY..!!
Sooo...all good so far, but here's where I have to add a concern. You mentioned Elk hunting and 300 yds. Shooting BP rifles with BIG bullets at long ranges will provide results out to 300 yds. that would humanely kill an Elk, or whatever you shoot at. I would remind anyone considering such a hunt that those big bullets fly at an incredible trajectory. At the range...we know EXACTLY what the distance is. With that knowledge we dial in our vernier sights, check the wind flags, read the mirage ( if present) and precisely place the bullet in the center of the target...( when we do everything right..). Unfortunately...hunting situations rarely offer precisely ranged targets at intervals for which we have carefully worked out the necessary sight adjustments to compensate and dial in a center hit. Given the trajectory of that big bullet it doesn't take much of an error in range estimation or application of sight adjustment, or windage to result in a less than ideal hit on an animal. When I was shooting BPCR if an Elk had stepped out from behind the 300 yd berm on a calm day...I could have taken the shot with complete confidence. Out in the mountains....where he might not be exactly 300 yds away, winds blowing, etc...I'm not so sure.
It certainly can be done, but you might have to be prepared to turn down opportunities so that when you do squeeze off that well aimed shot, you are confident that you will make a humane kill and not sadly wound and lose an animal.
Good Luck and best wishes in your new pursuit. I look forward to progress reports as you get deeper into that Rabbit Hole.!!

 

[nkbj]

Golly gosh I love making TC Renegades and New Englanders into new diameters.
Best wishes and many "cloudy" range days.

 

[Okurok]

Sooo...all good so far, but here's where I have to add a concern. You mentioned Elk hunting and 300 yds. Shooting BP rifles with BIG bullets at long ranges will provide results out to 300 yds. that would humanely kill an Elk, or whatever you shoot at. I would remind anyone considering such a hunt that those big bullets fly at an incredible trajectory. At the range...we know EXACTLY what the distance is. With that knowledge we dial in our vernier sights, check the wind flags, read the mirage ( if present) and precisely place the bullet in the center of the target...( when we do everything right..). Unfortunately...hunting situations rarely offer precisely ranged targets at intervals for which we have carefully worked out the necessary sight adjustments to compensate and dial in a center hit. Given the trajectory of that big bullet it doesn't take much of an error in range estimation or application of sight adjustment, or windage to result in a less than ideal hit on an animal. When I was shooting BPCR if an Elk had stepped out from behind the 300 yd berm on a calm day...I could have taken the shot with complete confidence. Out in the mountains....where he might not be exactly 300 yds away, winds blowing, etc...I'm not so sure.
It certainly can be done, but you might have to be prepared to turn down opportunities so that when you do squeeze off that well aimed shot, you are confident that you will make a humane kill and not sadly wound and lose an animal.
Good Luck and best wishes in your new pursuit. I look forward to progress reports as you get deeper into that Rabbit Hole.!!

Yeah, I hear ya. I don't know that I plan on shooting at an elk that far until I know what I'm working with. Once I get the mold I want and get things dialed in, then I can make better decisions at what ranges I would be comfortable at.

 

[Okurok]

Just got off the phone with a gentleman with Buffalo Arms and they can't get mold blocks to make the bullet mold so now way of knowing how long till I can get the mold I want. Gonna have to find something available commercially to even get shooting.

 

[Bad Karma]

Just got off the phone with a gentleman with Buffalo Arms and they can't get mold blocks to make the bullet mold so now way of knowing how long till I can get the mold I want. Gonna have to find something available commercially to even get shooting.

Accurate molds... dot com...

 

[excess650]

Accurate molds... dot com...

Absolutely! Tom can cut whatever you need for this project whether it be grooved or slick for paper patch. NOE may have a push-through sizer if you need that.

 

[Okurok]

Anyone have any experience with Accurate Mold 50-600c?

 

[Okurok]

Went ahead and ordered the 50-600c. Will find out what its like. Gonna get a .502 sizing die for my star lubrisizer and see how it likes it.

 

[Don Steele]

Before you size those bullets, I'm going to suggest you try lubing and shooting some "as cast". I've had some successes without sizing, just "pan-lubed".

 

[Mad Professor]

If you want to upgrade the trigger, the Davis Deerslayer only takes ~1/2 hour to install, the ones I've put in I never bothered adjusting they were so nice

 

[renegadehunter]

The bullet creeping up the barrel is a possible concern, especially with soft lead, and even worse with a tapered design "slip fit".
I remember reading a thread where Idaholewis talked about this problem, he caught one (tapered design) that had moved off the powder 2" in his dad's rifle. I believe he found that a 1:40 alloy greatly reduced the possibility of this occurring for him. He's on ModernMuzzleloader more than here, let me see if I can find the thread.
Here it is:
Taper design bullets (TC Maxi Type) | Modern Muzzleloader Muzzleloading Forum

 

[Okurok]

My local scrap dealer who sells steel and also will custom bend sheet metal for projects. Had them bend me some troughs for bluing tanks. I need to weld the ends on and weld up some stands for them before I can blue this barrel. So a question before bluing. Opposite the drum there is a hole where I'm assuming Rice drilled thru drill the drum. There is an allen head screw that is inset about an 1/8" that shows above the stock.

Wondering what I should do to make that look better. I'm thinking about putting in a bolt and filing it smooth and then bluing it. If I for some reason would need to remove it I suppose I could file a slot in it some how for a screwdriver. What does the hive think?

 

[Bad Karma]

I would plug it and blue right over it. I’m going to be doing that to my rice barrel when it arrives....

 

[Malamute]

What sights are people using for longer range muzzle loader shooting? Im not going to use super heavy bullets, my shoulder wont take it, but lighter ones will still lob out there once you get the sight setting worked out.

It occurred to me to check and see if trapdoor carbine sights may be available. Seems they could be workable. A decent tang sight would also be useful.

I expect Ill do a bit of longer range shooting with the TCs (45 and 50). I cant seem to help it, the place I shoot seems to invite trying with whatever one has with them. I probably wont shoot much over 600 yards, thats the farthest plate thats regularly out.

 

[Bad Karma]

I’m using either a globe front or a fiber optic bead front and at the rear either a Lyman 57 peep with Hadley eyecup or one of several mid range vernier rear sights...

very nice setup you have there!

 

[Malamute]

Its sure nice having access to public land where one can shoot, or whatever. Its close to home, I used to walk my dogs there pretty much every day.

Ill have to see what I can see there for front sights. I have a Lyman globe, but was going to use it on something else. The mid range vernier sounds interesting.

 

[Okurok]

I went with the Lyman 57 and Lyman 17 ABH front sight. The rear sight took a small amount of file work to fit properly.