Too much powder?

[Brokennock]

It may help your powder to think about what is printed on modern shotshells that you might use - the "drams equivalent" markings.

One dram is 27 grains of powder.... so a 54 gr load would be the 2 drams, and the mid 60s would get you the 2.5 dram that quite a lot of modern "light" field/target loads claim to duplicate.

You raise a good point.
But one also must keep in mind that modern thinking is that more and bigger and faster is automatically better, so we see a lot of 3 and 3 1/4 equivalent shells, even in smaller gauges. So? These dram equivalents give the marketers bigger numbers on the box for both powder charge and velocity,,,,, but that doesn't mean they will pattern well, and, those shells have shotcups designed to try to improve those patterns.
It might be interesting to look for older boxes, even pictures of older boxes, of shells that predate plastic shot cups and see what dram equivalents they were loading then.

 

[Brokennock]

but I have found out most new guys like to burn way too much powder.

Yup, but let's face it, so do a lot of guys who have been at this a while.

I mean, who wants to brag that they took that buck or turkey with 60 grains of powder when they can say they used 90, 100, or 120 grains?
I think it's the same thing as the middle aged balding guy, with an "unsatisfied" wife, that goes and buys a shiny new red sportscar, or big loud truck that he doesn't need.

 

[Rifleman1776]

cornmeal buffer

Really? What does the air smell like after each shot? Seriously, that sounds like an inconvenient and messy way of loading yer shottie.

 

[new2bp]

Really? What does the air smell like after each shot? Seriously, that sounds like an inconvenient and messy way of loading yer shottie.

Unsure on cornmeal, but grits add nothing to the smell... or detract from it

As far as loading.... a bit of preparedness lets you have tubes or other small containers preloaded with powder, shot, and grits. Or dispense from a horn or other container into measure just like you would with powder, grits don't flow much different from 2f or 3f - though cream of wheat may be more like 4f .

 

[Timber Wolf]

Unsure on cornmeal, but grits add nothing to the smell... or detract from it

As far as loading.... a bit of preparedness lets you have tubes or other small containers preloaded with powder, shot, and grits. Or dispense from a horn or other container into measure just like you would with powder, grits don't flow much different from 2f or 3f - though cream of wheat may be more like 4f .

Use Grits if you must, but leave the CoW for breakfast.

 

[Kev308]

Unsure on cornmeal, but grits add nothing to the smell... or detract from it

As far as loading.... a bit of preparedness lets you have tubes or other small containers preloaded with powder, shot, and grits. Or dispense from a horn or other container into measure just like you would with powder, grits don't flow much different from 2f or 3f - though cream of wheat may be more like 4f .

Cornmeal does leave a slightly sweet smell after the shot. Loading for me is as follows
Powder comes from my horn. Cornmeal and shot charge come from paper tubes kept in my bag. Cm goes on top of the powder charge. The shot gets dumped on too of that then the card holds it all in place. Simple and fairly quick too.
I’m going out tuesday to try out the lighter powder charge. Will report after
Kevin

 

[deerstalkert]

You raise a good point.
But one also must keep in mind that modern thinking is that more and bigger and faster is automatically better, so we see a lot of 3 and 3 1/4 equivalent shells, even in smaller gauges. So? These dram equivalents give the marketers bigger numbers on the box for both powder charge and velocity,,,,, but that doesn't mean they will pattern well, and, those shells have shotcups designed to try to improve those patterns.
It might be interesting to look for older boxes, even pictures of older boxes, of shells that predate plastic shot cups and see what dram equivalents they were loading then.

i have a bunch of old paper shells. will look for that information. if i wake up tomorrow, and remember what it was i was going to do!
knew i couldn't sleep for trying to remember what i was trying to remember, so crawled up to the attic and found these. this is a full box. have some win and rem from the same era and they don't give the dram's
made when there was pride in product. just love the graphics.

 

[B P Maniac Shooter]

I have been spending a fair amount of time trying to work out a good shot load for my smoothbore. Both are .62 one a fowler the other a shortened Fusil. I have tried pretty much every loading technique found on this site. I have settled on 85 gr 2f cornmeal buffer and 90 gr of #6 shot covered with a card.
This combo works well but I’m wondering; is this too much powder?
Do I need to load it this hot? What do you all suggest?
This is intended for small game only, I’m going to work on a turkey load at a later date.
Thanks,
Kevin

I like that load....I use 90 grains of 2F, so, there isn't much difference in our loads.
If that load works best for you, I'd stick with it.

 

[deerstalkert]

I only am able to hunt grouse anymore so i just use a square load in my 11 gauge. usually 60g fff with felt wad, card, 60g by volume #7.5 (because it is all i have currently) with double card or hornets nest whichever is at hand.
we had grouse for thanksgiving. 8 of us and only my grass fed sister didn't have each a grouse. load works for me.

 

[IanH]

I got on the "dram equivalent" bandwagon from the start. Then I watched some Dualist1954 videos and tried his ridiculous loads. Then I get on here and try the undersquare loads everyone raves about and also try 3F but find the pellets won't penetrate both sides of a beer can at 25 yards. Back to dram equivalent and 2F in the 20 and 24 gauges, good patterns and plenty of killing power.

Cornmeal is magic. If you can smell it you might be using too much or aren't putting anything between lowder and meal.

Complete load of powder, wad, buffer, shot, and overshot card in a paper cartridge, 2F, and take you load from of the lid of a box of cartridges matching the gauge of your gun.

I use a folded paper "card" to keep the powder separated from the cornmeal and fold/glue the shot end closed like a coin roll to retain the shot. Tear the long tail off, dump the powder, wad the tube up to make a separator wad/cushion, load tail down.

If you have a hole in your pattern you likely have pellets sticking to your cushion wad making it heavy enough to disrupt the cloud.

 

[Brokennock]

i have a bunch of old paper shells. will look for that information. if i wake up tomorrow, and remember what it was i was going to do!
knew i couldn't sleep for trying to remember what i was trying to remember, so crawled up to the attic and found these. this is a full box. have some win and rem from the same era and they don't give the dram's
made when there was pride in product. just love the graphics.
View attachment 272099View attachment 272101View attachment 272100

Wow! Awesome old box. Thanks.
3 3/4 dram and marked "heavy load."
I wonder how they pattern.

 

[smo]

Those are Federal Hi Power shot shells..

The “Field Load “ Federal shells we used for quail hunting in the mid 60’s were 2 3/4 Drams & 1 1/8 oz of 7 1/2 shot.

 

[Juice Jaws]

Yup, but let's face it, so do a lot of guys who have been at this a while.

I mean, who wants to brag that they took that buck or turkey with 60 grains of powder when they can say they used 90, 100, or 120 grains?
I think it's the same thing as the middle aged balding guy, with an "unsatisfied" wife, that goes and buys a shiny new red sportscar, or big loud truck that he doesn't need.

Yes I know some of those guys, have a few friends that do reloading ( on things we can't talk about) and they always have to reload to the max plus one grain more, never understood it. Always have to have the biggest with the mostly

 

[Encore50Cal]

I found this a long time ago on a black powder forum. This is the formula that British officers used on the old gun ships to ensure they had enough powder for troops and the ships cannons. I have used it and it is pretty darn accurate. To check the accuracy, when I sighted in my 50 cal Hawken I started at 55 gr and worked my way up and low and behold I settled on 75 gr. Pretty much dead on for this formula.
I figured the British Naval officers had to have their act together or the outcome of a battle would end terribly wrong. You can try it out and see if it comes close to what you are using. No harm done if it isn't good enough for you to use.

Formula for figuring out black powder load for any firearm.

diameter of ball X diameter of ball X length of barrel, divided by 9 = optimum powder load.

50 Cal Hawkin powder load

.495 X .495 X 28 ÷ 9 = 76.2

 

[Jeff Davis]

Well there you have it,,,, if duelist1954 says it's okay,,,, it must be gospel.

Yes I do trust Mike and maybe you should also. It's a fact that each gun shoots differently and if he's worked on his load then who are you to glibly say "to much powder.

 

[IanH]

Yes I do trust Mike and maybe you should also. It's a fact that each gun shoots differently and if he's worked on his load then who are you to glibly say "to much powder.

110 grains of powder and an ounce and a half of shot in a 20 gauge is a little excessive IMO.

 

[William Lincoln]

Juice Jaws is correct. Too much powder for sporting uses.
Very often a lighter load is the best performing load for
the job. Definitely for accuracy.

 

[Terrier]

I found this a long time ago on a black powder forum. This is the formula that British officers used on the old gun ships to ensure they had enough powder for troops and the ships cannons. I have used it and it is pretty darn accurate. To check the accuracy, when I sighted in my 50 cal Hawken I started at 55 gr and worked my way up and low and behold I settled on 75 gr. Pretty much dead on for this formula.
I figured the British Naval officers had to have their act together or the outcome of a battle would end terribly wrong. You can try it out and see if it comes close to what you are using. No harm done if it isn't good enough for you to use.

Formula for figuring out black powder load for any firearm.

diameter of ball X diameter of ball X length of barrel, divided by 9 = optimum powder load.

50 Cal Hawkin powder load

.495 X .495 X 28 ÷ 9 = 76.2

My .50 Cal TC Hawken with a 29" barrel shoots great with an 80 gr load. .495 X .495 X 29 / 9 = .7895 That's pretty durn close!

My .40 cal Kibler SMR works out to be virtually the same load (.7822) with its 44" barrel using that formula, although I generally use 50 gr for shots to 50 yards and it shoots awesome groups. But coincidentally, 80 gr turned out to be my best load for longer shots. Eerie.

 

[oldschoolhunter55]

The lighter charge will work better with 3f or finer still. Promise!
I refuse to use anything else now after 30 years of hunting with a muzzloader.

Powder I have is half way between 3&4f.
View attachment 271934

like that smoke. that dog is enjoying his day. thanks for video

 

[oldschoolhunter55]

i have a bunch of old paper shells. will look for that information. if i wake up tomorrow, and remember what it was i was going to do!
knew i couldn't sleep for trying to remember what i was trying to remember, so crawled up to the attic and found these. this is a full box. have some win and rem from the same era and they don't give the dram's
made when there was pride in product. just love the graphics.
View attachment 272099View attachment 272101View attachment 272100

thats a nice box dang.