Traditions Pennsylvania rifle

[sprucefly]

I just got my first flintlock, a Traditions Pennsylvania .50. The comb is a little high for me. I can only line up the sights with my head towards the butt of the stock. If I crawl my head forward, I can't line up the sights. Is this normal on a flintlock to keep yoour head away from the lock? I'm a stock crawler so I will probably work the front part of the comb down.


Anyone else have a problem w/this and how did you solve it?

 

Yep, same problem on a Yugo M-48A rifle, keep your head way back and it's fine, snug in for a bench shot and all you're too high. Rather than modifying the rifle, modify your habits. Keeping your head back is not only safey no matter what type of gun you fire but also will make your sighting more accurate. The longer the sight plane, the more accurate the sight picture will be. I don't understand why the rear sight is placed so far up the barrel on most ML's. The more distance you have between front and rear sight, the more you will notice allignment errors and adding the additional 10" or more from your eyeball to the rear sight will also cut down on allignment error.

 

IMO its the design of that rifle, of which I loved to shoot but my face was allways sore and I hated cleaning all that brass and LMAO
When you lay you cheek over on the stock you should be about dead center if the draw length, offset and drop are right for you.
My problem with the TPA was that the comb would come and fit snug right under my cheek bone do to the drop of the stock and having high cheek bones. with any load over 70 grains with a RB I would see stars, a hunting load would almost knock me out.

Here is what I would do. Place a band of leather around the stock where you feel most comfortable with the site picture. Now go out and sight it in while placing your cheek on the leather. This will give you the site picture your comfortable with and the ability stay on target. Once you get used to that spot you can remove the leather.

 

It is not you or your shooting habits. The engineering on this stock is horrid! No one should try to shoot with their head back against the buttplate! (I was tempted to insert a SA comment about people that drive and shoot things called Yugos in this space. I decided to be nice instead.) A couple of hours work with a sureform tool and sandpaper will solve the problem.

Then you will have to strip the finish from the rest of the rifle with lacquer thinner, or Formby's stripper, and give it an oil finish. Better schedule the evenings for a week or save it for a rainy weekend. After that you will be happy as a bug.

It's a Traditions, there are about ten zillion of them out there. Fix it the way you want it, you are not damaging a collectors piece.

 

I am truely sorry you bought this piece & that you thought it was somewhat close to being what was shot 200 years ago. It isn't even remotely close as no rifles were ever made with stocks like that.
; The only fix I can suggest, is to sand the stock down to where you can shoot it with your face in the right place.
: Such "REPLICAs" have been sold since the early 70's & they actually copy no original as the originals were designed to be shot accurately from proper holds. Some manufacturers put very high sights to compensate for little or no drop at the comb. The origianls generally had very low, barrel hugging sights on them.

 

[Flintshooter in Indiana]

I see a lot of questions about problems people are having with guns they buy out of catalogs and various other places. The problems could be solved if you would take the time to research the equipment you are buying and to handle the weapons. Hold it to your shoulder, check the trigger pull, the drop of the stock, the cast off, etc.
You have to remember when you by from Traditions, Blue Ridge, etc. that these are PRODUCTION guns and are not made to fit every shooter. They are standard. Everyone has a different preference and every architecture of gun has a different wrist, drop, butt plate style, trigger style, lock, etc.
Talk to your friends and try to handle as many different styles as you can. Before you by a flintlock, try somebody's to see if you like it or not. Try a percussion also. After you deceide what's right for you, then make your purchase. It's awful tough to find that the gun you just purchased isn't right for you or doesn't fit your shooting style. Flintshooter.

 

Alas - if it were only possible to find potential Muzzlelaoder shooters BEFORE they buy. Unfortunately, the firearm is purchased first, then they look for a site that can help with questions.

 

There are some things I will not buy unless I can try them first. Clothes, shoes, cars and guns, and not necessarily in that order. I have always reworked my guns until the "fit me" like comfortable shoes and if they did not we soon parted. If the gun feels right it is easier to concentrate on the fundimentals, or follow them instinctivly.

 

[TwoShadows]

well, all the above posts have merit..and come from some experience....except for one. Sorry Mark, but the forward sight situation will explain itself when you pass midle age and the old cornea's dont squeeze and contract like they do now. I have owned originals where the rear sight has been moved forward 2-3 times.....to accomodate the older eyes of the original owner I betcha. Please dont think I am picking on you....I am indiscriminate in who I disagree with...I mean no disrespect. Shadows

 

I think we all missed what was asking here.
jacksoncountyrifle
Don

 

Sorry for the yugo comment, it was only to express "I know the feeling". I had a very hard time finding an ML I could shoulder and get a good feel and sight picture with on the pull-up without having to work at it, that's how I got my Lyman deerstalker.

To expand on what others said about finding potential ML buyers BEFORE they buy....ya man you hit the nail on the head big time. I love my Lyman but would have much rather invested the time and money into building a .62 right off the bat.

I also agree on go ahead and modify the stock but offered my suggestion of selt training as a way of avoiding the modification if the poster was not inclined to do such.

and... I ain't never claimed to be the sharpest tool in the shed and when people disagree with me I listen and try to learn something. Didn't think about the "aging eyes" problem, I have a hard time when the rear sight is too far out to get a clear picture of it.

 

[tg]

The problems with production gun is part of the learning curve many of us have traveled over the years, you can usually make a shooter out of one and go to the next level if the bug bites hard, you know you are dealing with tired old eyes when you have one 3/4 wide dove tail at the muzzle which holds both the front and rear sight....

 

[sprucefly]

Thanks for the info. I will take the comb down. I've got a .62 caliber Bucks County rifle being made. I bought the TPR to learn about flintlocks before I get my .62. I got it wholesale so I could learn about tuning locks, getting use to the flash, etc.

I've been shooting caplocks since I was a kid. I've got over 20 originals and 1 GPR and 1 T/C Hawken. I've never had a problem like this w/any caplock. I didn't know if it was a normal situation w/flintlocks or just a bad stock design. I think I got my answer. Thanks.

 

[Huntinfool]

Yea I agree with the people who said it's a horrid stock design. My neighbor has one it hurt his cheek so bad he had our gunsmith friend to rework the stock. I had trouble getting my head down low enough to see the sights well also.

With that stock design it doesn't matter how good your eyes are it simply doesn't fit the large majority of folks.

After my neighbor got it back with a lower comb he shot real well with it. He could see the sights better and no bruised cheek.

YMH&OS
Chuck Goodall
"The Original Huntin' Fool"
&
Kanawha Ranger Scribe

 

Lots of people use the "starter rifle" theory for getting into BP. It is very much like trying to learn to play guitar on a cheap, badly built and impossible to play instrument. You will give up out of frustration before you really learn.

I am thankful for the Lyman GPR and TC product in this reguard. I personally do not prefer half stocked plains rifles, but these products at least give reasonable quality in an economical package for nonbuilders that wish to enter BP sports.

Almost every comunity in the U.S. has a BP club of some sort. It is a pity that these clubs do not do more to promote the good will of other shooters by allowing newbies to experience what shooting a "good rifle" is like before they spend their money on "junk".

Traditions and CVA locks are basically untunable. The relationships of the parts is bad and the critical parts are case hardened rather than heat treated throughout. You can improve them some, but the results will never be equil to a modeately well built Siler, Davis or L&R lock. Most of the locks are unbridled and the strains on the metal unsupported. The set triggers on most of these products are terrible and almost impossible to use in unset mode (CVA does have Traditions beat in the set trigger area).

The point is do not give up on BP shooting when you find the rifle you have purchased is far, far less than perfect. Hopefully your "bucks county" rifle will be all you hoped for.

It seems like every new shooter that posts on the forum is shooting a piece of manure and waiting for their "good gun" to come home from the shop. No wonder there is a barrel and lock shortage from the major suppliers!