US Model 1803 Prototype Rifles Article

[tsmgguy]

https://americansocietyofarmscollec...6/2008-B97-U-S-Model-1803-Prototype-Rifle.pdf

 

[Mattox Forge]

The existence of the prototype is incontrovertible and facinating in and of itself. There is controversy about whether or not Lewis and Clark used the Model 1803 "prototype" rifle, e.g. 1st 15 rifles produced in their expedition, or modified (shortened) 1792 Contact rifles. If you read all of the available evidence there is no direct evidence extant, at least that I know of, that shows exactly what type the 15 rifles issued to Lewis for the expedition were. Basically all we know about them is that Lewis was issued rifles at the Harpers Ferry Armory, and that they were referred to as "short" rifles.

There is a strong circumstantial and logical case to be made for the rifles being the 1st 15 M1803 rifles made

As far as the 1792 Contract rifles being the rifles used, there is also no direct evidence that the rifles used in the expedition were shortened 1792 contract rifles. This supposition is based on the assumption that there were no M1803 type rifles available.

There is some information on the Rifle Shoppe wbsite about this:
http://www.therifleshoppe.com/catalog_pages/us_arms/(935).htm
It is a topic of debate, and probably will be until definitive proof is unearthed. I happen to like the idea of the M1803 rifles being the ones used.

Mike

 

[Col. Batguano]

Easy answer. What kind of guns did they use in the movie? You know Hollywood never gets it wrong!

 

[Johnny Tremain]

Always thought the 1892 was the porotype.
Live and learn

 

[Grenadier1758]

@Johnny Tremain, Don Stith thought it was the 1792 Contract Rifles that were modified for the Corps of Discovery. They were bored out to 54 caliber, shortened and converted to use the interchangeable parts lock. Lewis took 15 of those locks for maintenance of the rifles.

 

[Flint62Smoothie]

All the evidence is in the document attached folks ... including details of serial #1 of the 15 'short rifles' 1st made ...

 

[Dphar1950]

The existence of the prototype is incontrovertible and facinating in and of itself. There is controversy about whether or not Lewis and Clark used the Model 1803 "prototype" rifle, e.g. 1st 15 rifles produced in their expedition, or modified (shortened) 1792 Contact rifles. If you read all of the available evidence there is no direct evidence extant, at least that I know of, that shows exactly what type the 15 rifles issued to Lewis for the expedition were. Basically all we know about them is that Lewis was issued rifles at the Harpers Ferry Armory, and that they were referred to as "short" rifles.

There is a strong circumstantial and logical case to be made for the rifles being the 1st 15 M1803 rifles made

As far as the 1792 Contract rifles being the rifles used, there is also no direct evidence that the rifles used in the expedition were shortened 1792 contract rifles. This supposition is based on the assumption that there were no M1803 type rifles available.

There is some information on the Rifle Shoppe wbsite about this:
http://www.therifleshoppe.com/catalog_pages/us_arms/(935).htm
It is a topic of debate, and probably will be until definitive proof is unearthed. I happen to like the idea of the M1803 rifles being the ones used.

Mike

IIRC the records show that the original order for the 1803 was exceeded by 15 rifles. Also. Since there were no blueprints at this time they made samples and sent at least one to Dearborne so the rifles were in production as prototypes when Lewis was there. Dearborn then sent back a letter telling them what he wanted changed, just minor things like the upper rod pipe. Further. The Contract rifles were basically junk and made by a variety of contractors and Lewis had served on an expedition where they were used and would have known their issues. Also the 1803s were known to burst in the round section. L&C had two such failures of the “short rifles” and Zebulon Pike had such failures of the 1803 as well. AND a prototypical (barrel contour or/or rod pipes were slightly different IIRC) 1803 with a low enough number to be a L&C rifle was found in relic condition in the St Louis area and remember they auctioned off everything when they got back to St Louis. Given the Contract Rifle reputation, they were all relocked with a Harper Ferry lock such as used on the 1803 to make then serviceable, I cannot see Lewis wanting them on an expedition such as he was embarking on. See the May 1985 issue of the “American Rifleman” for an article on the relic rifle. Then “We Proceeded On” May 2006 for more info/research and speculation on this rifle. The 1803 was in development for several years. Starting about 1800 from the 2006 article available here https://lewisandclark.org/wpo/pdf/vol32no2.pdf

 

[Dphar1950]

I had forgotten the Carrick article. Thanks for posting.