Using a powder horn

[ronnie_kennedy]

My shooting buddy and I were having a discussion last night about our powder horns. We ordered 2 from track of the wolf and have since "customized" them according to our tastes. Anyways, he was saying that he was a bit nervous to use his for 2 reasons. He stated that he felt a stray spark could ignite the horn on his side and also black powder was hygroscopic (i think thats the word he used) and drew moisture. Both of us being new to using a powder horn i figured i would check in and see what you all thought.

So, how common, if any chance, is it to ignite a powder horn from a stray spark from your flintlock pistol going off, and has anyone ever had any trouble with moisture getting into your horn and messing up your powder. I told him that if he was that worried about it, then don't wear the horn and just sit it on the bench at the range. Also if he felt it would draw moisture, then empty the contents of his horn back into his goex can when done shooting and for storing. What do you think? :hmm:

 

[BrownBear]

With discipline (capping, pouring into a measure rather than a bore, etc) I don't see a risk from sparks.

As for hygroscopic issues, I live and play in 120 inches of rain a year. With a tight-fitting plug (several times I rub beeswax into the side of the plug, then put it in the horn and spin it around. Pretty quick all gaps are filled and the plug will "grab" a little when you seat it with a twist) and a little extra precaution, I've never had the slightest issue with wet powder- even shooting in the rain. The extra measure for me is either sealing the base plug with beeswax at the time I make the horn, or in a commercial horn such as yours, warming some beeswax and working it into the seam between the baseplug and the horn body. I've had my horns out in the rain for many hours without issue.

 

[DUSTY 14]

powder horns have served black powder shooters for hundreds of years. if the problems mentioned were common something else would have replaced horns long ago. mine has been in rain and stored in an unheated car or on board a boat in the pacific north wet for months and no problem. Lewis and Clark poured from lead cans to horns with no problem. all that said never ever load into the barrel of a weapon from anything but the measure.
p.s. my fiance and i have shot over a hundred rounds from rifle/pistol/tradegun in the last month all from the horn and not any fear or problem. hard to load unless i am wearing my horn

 

[VTdeerhunter]

I agree with all of Brown Bear's tips. Common sense is critical in all shooting sports. I don't see the powder horn as any more dangerous then watching the sharp edges of your knife and axe, or muzzle control on your gun.

 

[roundball]

And, the notion of black powder being hydroscopic is really talking about black powder "fouling"...not the powder itself.

On days of high humidity, before I can reload and get ready to prime again, the little bit of fouling in the pan has turned to glistening wet soup from sucking moisture out of the air in just a minute or so.

 

[necchi]

All good responces so far, but BrownBear layed it out pretty simple.
Seal the base plug an spout plug with wax and have no worries.
:wink:

 

[paulvallandigham]

I don't smoke or permit others to smoke around any OPEN containers of powder. That includes powder horns. I don't sit near an open fire with my powder horns open, either.

When you load your powder measure with powder from a horn, you remove the plug from the horn ONLY for that purpose. The plug goes back into the horn when the measure is full and BEFORE you pour the powder in the measure down the muzzle. ALWAYS USE A SEPARATE POWDER MEASURE FROM YOUR POWDER CONTAINER. NEVER USE A POWDER HORN WITH THE MEASURE ATTACHED! Using a measure attached to the horn forces you to rely on the mechanical design of the measure's cut-off valve to protect you from getting a spark or flame into the larger powder container.

Anything mechanical can fail. I found that out using a POWDER flask with its thin, cut-off plate. I put the flask on the loading bench, and when I looked up, powder was slowly dripping out the neck of the flask. Crud had built up on that cut-off plate, and kept it from closing properly. I had to take the head off the flask to get to the cut-off plate and give it a thorough cleaning before it would work as " Advertised". I stopped using that flask to carry powder, and it now carries only Farina, which is used as a "filler" in lieu of an OP wad in some rifles.

When you buy Black powder it usually comes with a designation as to granular size, such as "FFg" . The small "g" is an indicator that the powder is coated in graphite to protect it from absorbing moisture( and ignition from static electricity). Black Powder residue and some priming powders for flintlocks do not have graphite on them, and will absorb moisture("Hygroscopic")from the air.

In field use, its fairly easy to protect your powder charge from taking on moisture, short of being dunked in a lake. Some put a vapor barrier between the powder and PRB; some tape the muzzle to keep rain, fog, mist, drizzle, etc. out of their barrels and powder. The easiest water barriers for both ends of a percussion rifle, or smoothbore is to use plastic wrap behind the PRB, and then put a bit of plastic wrap over the nipple before you seat the percussion cap. Oiled cloth, or leather is more traditionally used for these same purposes, if that is important to you.

A cow's knee is used on Flintlocks to shield the lock and flash pan from moisture. Grease or wax is also used around the frizzen to seal it from moisture getting to the priming powder in the pan.

Most flintlock shooters switch from using 4F powder in the pan to 3Fg or 2Fg, depending n what powder they are putting down the barrel for the main charge. The powder does burn a bit slower, but you can't move your sights off the target in those few microseconds of difference. :hatsoff:

We have better powders, better locks, better barrels, and smarter shooters today than existed 200 years ago. We have had all that time to figure out how to solve some of the problems our ancestors wrote about back then. :thumbsup: :hatsoff:

 

[Rifleman1776]

And, the notion of black powder being hydroscopic is really talking about black powder "fouling"...not the powder itself.

On days of high humidity, before I can reload and get ready to prime again, the little bit of fouling in the pan has turned to glistening wet soup from sucking moisture out of the air in just a minute or so.

RB said it first and well. I double reinforce what he said. BP, by itself, is NOT hygroscopic.
Use yer horn. Enjoy. Follow basic safety and commone sense rules.

 

[ronnie_kennedy]

Sounds good and thanks for the advice everyone. I plan on using my horn no matter what. I will look into sealing the plug a little, and of course use common sense when loading and shooting. I bought the horn, engraved it myself and made the strap. I don't buy guns or accessories to hang on the wall and look at. I i buy it, i use it, or shoot it! :thumbsup:

 

[Loyalist Dave]

The only documented reports of a powder carrying problem in "recent" memory, for me say the last 20 years, there are three..., one was a fellow who was using "pellets" at the range and did not properly seal nor position the container when he was going to fire, and sparks from his muzzle touched off his remaining pellets..., one was a Native American reenactor using cartridges and a cloth bag, and a stray spark burned through and touched off a few cartridges. :shocked2: The last was in the last twelve months, where a fellow wearing his horn, walked over to inspect his fired patches lying on the ground. One of which was smouldering, and he didn't realize his horn plug had come out of the horn. So when he bent at the waist to pick up one of his fired patches, the horn poured some powder out, and as luck would have it, it landed on the smouldering patch and WHOOOM! :shocked2: As for sparks detonating a sealed horn, I have not heard of such in a properly finished and plugged horn.

LD

 

[Loyalist Dave]

The only documented reports of a powder carrying problem in "recent" memory, for me say the last 20 years, there are three..., one was a fellow who was using "pellets" at the range and did not properly seal nor position the container when he was going to fire, and sparks from his muzzle touched off his remaining pellets..., one was a Native American reenactor using cartridges and a cloth bag, and a stray spark burned through and touched off a few cartridges. :shocked2: The last was in the last twelve months, where a fellow wearing his horn, walked over to inspect his fired patches lying on the ground. One of which was smouldering, and he didn't realize his horn plug had come out of the horn. So when he bent at the waist to pick up one of his fired patches, the horn poured some powder out, and as luck would have it, it landed on the smouldering patch and WHOOOM! :shocked2: As for sparks detonating a sealed horn, I have not heard of such in a properly finished and plugged horn.

LD

 

[paulvallandigham]

Emphasis on "properly PLUGGED".

 

[paulvallandigham]

Emphasis on "properly PLUGGED".

 

[omarick1948]

Shooting black powder arms can be about as dangerous as jay walking on a busy street at rush hour...That's one of the reasons they invented traffic lights and crossing-walk signals! ... Basically a tool for people to use common sense!

Same is true with shooting and carrying black powder. __ A person first has to be responsible and use common sense in handling any guns and propellants! __ Forget about those Hollywood movies and TV where those Actor's just pour right down the muzzles from the horn! __ If I had a bunch of Savages chasing me, Yes, I probably would be doing the same, but these are modern times and not Hollywood! __ You haven't got a bunch of "Bugs Boys" chasing you and trying to take your scalp!

That said, I have only seen one incident with a powder horn flaring (not exploding) from a guy years ago at an event where a "Dipstick" mixed "Who hit John" with running around camp wearing his powder horn
with apparently no stopper in it as someone told the "Yahoo" his horn was hanging on his strap and the stopper was out of his horn and just hanging!

After the ruckus, it was determined, that apparently a spark from a campfire (that he was getting to close to) found it's way to his open horn and when that horn went off, it looked like a fireworks fountain on the 4th of July on his side. He didn't get burnt, or nobody else did either, but it could of been a much worse out come and one I and others will remember!

That is one reason that I never make a tethered cord attached to my horns and if someone who orders a horn from me wants one, I tell them the above story, as I truly believe that all horn stoppers should be independent and not attached by a string, cord leather or what have you. This makes and force's the user more aware of a stopper needed in their horn, especially when they have to hold that stopper in their other hand, teeth etc. __ Powder horns are not the problem! ..... It's too reckless people not paying attention to what their doing or walk around with dangerous habits!

Sorry, for the long story, but well worth the time for you to read and me to tell!

Rick

 

[omarick1948]

Shooting black powder arms can be about as dangerous as jay walking on a busy street at rush hour...That's one of the reasons they invented traffic lights and crossing-walk signals! ... Basically a tool for people to use common sense!

Same is true with shooting and carrying black powder. __ A person first has to be responsible and use common sense in handling any guns and propellants! __ Forget about those Hollywood movies and TV where those Actor's just pour right down the muzzles from the horn! __ If I had a bunch of Savages chasing me, Yes, I probably would be doing the same, but these are modern times and not Hollywood! __ You haven't got a bunch of "Bugs Boys" chasing you and trying to take your scalp!

That said, I have only seen one incident with a powder horn flaring (not exploding) from a guy years ago at an event where a "Dipstick" mixed "Who hit John" with running around camp wearing his powder horn
with apparently no stopper in it as someone told the "Yahoo" his horn was hanging on his strap and the stopper was out of his horn and just hanging!

After the ruckus, it was determined, that apparently a spark from a campfire (that he was getting to close to) found it's way to his open horn and when that horn went off, it looked like a fireworks fountain on the 4th of July on his side. He didn't get burnt, or nobody else did either, but it could of been a much worse out come and one I and others will remember!

That is one reason that I never make a tethered cord attached to my horns and if someone who orders a horn from me wants one, I tell them the above story, as I truly believe that all horn stoppers should be independent and not attached by a string, cord leather or what have you. This makes and force's the user more aware of a stopper needed in their horn, especially when they have to hold that stopper in their other hand, teeth etc. __ Powder horns are not the problem! ..... It's too reckless people not paying attention to what their doing or walk around with dangerous habits!

Sorry, for the long story, but well worth the time for you to read and me to tell!

Rick

 

[Woods Dweller]

Here is another discussion on this same subject.
http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/242129/post/804724/hl//fromsearch/1/

 

[Woods Dweller]

Here is another discussion on this same subject.
http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/242129/post/804724/hl//fromsearch/1/

 

[omarick1948]

This will be one of those never ending stories, so just use common sense everybody!

:2

 

[omarick1948]

This will be one of those never ending stories, so just use common sense everybody!

:2

 

[crockett]

No one has mentioned this- so I will. They were not very common but a few horns were turned into horn flasks by putting a flask head on the horn. Looks just like a regular powder horn but with the flask head on the tip. If you are worried about the peg not adequately sealing the horn, etc- you could consider a flask horn. Some really cheap horns have a peg with a taper that is too abrupt and doesn't fit in the drilled hole just right but any good horn should not be a problem. Worked fine for hundreds of years. :wink: