Weight of Military heritage fusil & northwest trade guns

[CS]

Hello friends! I am really interested in purchasing either a fusil de chasse or northwest trade gun (ordinary or chief's version) from military heritage. I know that these aren't the best quality, however, it is probably all that I can afford over the next little while unfortunately.

curious if any folks here own either? And if so, can you give a measurement of its weight?

I do know that people here have said the Indian made guns tend to be chunkier than the more elegant custom built ones. As I am looking for a lightweight fusil or NW trade gun from MH and I don't yet have the skill to do woodwork (just started dabbling in this hobby), I wanted to get an idea of how much weightier the MH pieces actually are?

Thanks a ton!

 

[FlinterNick]

Hello friends! I am really interested in purchasing either a fusil de chasse or northwest trade gun (ordinary or chief's version) from military heritage. I know that these aren't the best quality, however, it is probably all that I can afford over the next little while unfortunately.

curious if any folks here own either? And if so, can you give a measurement of its weight?

I do know that people here have said the Indian made guns tend to be chunkier than the more elegant custom built ones. As I am looking for a lightweight fusil or NW trade gun from MH and I don't yet have the skill to do woodwork (just started dabbling in this hobby), I wanted to get an idea of how much weightier the MH pieces actually are?

Thanks a ton!

The weights vary, I’d put them on the heavy side between 11-13 lbs.

 

[ArmorerRoy]

Access/ Military Heritage fowler doglock. It weighs 8 pounds.

 

[CS]

Thanks so much ArmorerRoy! That info is really appreciated!
Based on your info, I estimate the fusil de chasse to be about the same, because it is thinner at .625 caliber rather than .69, but it is a bit longer (60 vs 58 in)

And based on what you said I am hoping that the Tecumseh trade gun will be < 7 pounds , since it is thinner at .625 and it is only 52 in long. If anyone owns one, I'd love to confirm, thanks again!

Access/ Military Heritage fowler doglock. It weighs 8 pounds.
View attachment 306694

 

[Leadball loader]

Thanks so much ArmorerRoy! That info is really appreciated!
Based on your info, I estimate the fusil de chasse to be about the same, because it is thinner at .625 caliber rather than .69, but it is a bit longer (60 vs 58 in)

And based on what you said I am hoping that the Tecumseh trade gun will be < 7 pounds , since it is thinner at .625 and it is only 52 in long. If anyone owns one, I'd love to confirm, thanks again!

I have two Fusee De Chasse from MH that both weight bit over eight pounds.My Northwest Trade gun Weighs seven and a half pounds in the long version.
I have had good fun working on these guns and shooting!
LBL

 

[Flint62Smoothie]

FWIW if you can get the same model from Veteran Arms, then I would highly recommend it.

I have a brass-barreled blunderbuss in "for repair" right now ... and the build quality is simply ATROCIOUS!

And yet I've inspected and actually have personally shot 3 VA flintlock arms myself and all their locks as received worked and sparked well, needing ZERO tweaking or input from the User. VA also drills for the touch hole and goes though them. Comparable arms between the 2 sources cost $150 more from VA than MH, but I do feel that they are build to a much higher quality standard.

This MH Donderbusche on the other hand ... the 'repair' is to just make it WORK for the new Owner! There's a 0.030" gap between the breech plug and barrel inlet, a 0.040" gap between the lock bolster and the side of the barrel, the frizzen spring is soooooooo durn strong that I'll put it on the rear axle of a Ford F250 instead ... as I can't move the frizzen without using BOTH hands! And yes, with the spring removed the frizzen moves fine.

I can't tell yet if she'll even spark, as a flint just smashes into the frizzen face ... won't even budge it. Overall though it also has a bad, gritty and heavy trigger pull. I've had none such issues with any arm procurred from VA.

 

[CS]

Thanks so much leadball loader & flint62smoothie for the kind advice. @Flint62Smoothie wow that is a horror story of a purchase! Good to know, thank you.

 

[Rob M.]

My Whately style N.W. Trade gun , 40" ,20 ga. barrel , bottom , 5.8 pds .

 

[Clark Badgett]

My Whately style N.W. Trade gun , 40" ,20 ga. barrel , bottom , 5.8 pds .

And I am sure yours are light years ahead in quality.

 

[Rob M.]

And I am sure yours are light years ahead in quality.

Just a d@mn ole trade gun ! Oh yeah , mine are guaranteed . If the person doesnt like it , they can return it for full refund .

 

[Stumpkiller]

I can tell you this. I have an English fowler of 0.662" bore with a 42" barrel. It weighs 7 lbs on the nose. My Light Infantry "carbine" Bess, same barrel length and bore size, weighed about 9-1/2 lbs. But the Long Land Pattern is sturdy for a purpose. It mounted a bayonet, could be swung as a club, and was not for fast shooting at game (back then men stood in ranks and fired by drill and order until close enough to charge). VERY different beasts.

As Rob M. points out, the NWTG were even lighter.

 

[Clark Badgett]

I can tell you this. I have an English fowler of 0.662" bore with a 42" barrel. It weighs 7 lbs on the nose. My Light Infantry "carbine" Bess, same barrel length and bore size, weighed about 9-1/2 lbs. But the Long Land Pattern is sturdy for a purpose. It mounted a bayonet, could be swung as a club, and was not for fast shooting at game (back then men stood in ranks and fired by drill and order until close enough to charge). VERY different beasts.

As Rob M. points out, the NWTG were even lighter.

A NWTG with a proper barrel weighs almost nothing (seemingly)

 

[Commodore Swab]

Something to consider regarding the fusion that is offered by middlesex/veteran/loyalist has a lock with a lower wider unbridled frizzen that is more correct for an earlier time period. If you are looking for an earlier fusion with a more correct lock india or rifle shoppe parts sets are your only options.

 

[Rob M.]

A NWTG with a proper barrel weighs almost nothing (seemingly)

They are so light , its amazing . My N.W. guns and Fusils are the lightest ones I know of but mine weight more than the originals ive handled. I remember the curator handing me an original and I was just amazed ! I could have held that long barreled trade gun out one handed and not shook ! It was so incredibly light ! Ken Netting makes my barrels so wonderfully that my guns are the closest in weight to original trade guns that I know of . Barrel being the major part that dictates the weight of a gun ...

 

[CyrusP]

The NWTG I just bought here has a Ken Netting barrel as well and the weight is astonishing. Like you said, Rob, you can hold it out one-handed without shaking. It’s LIGHT!

 

[Clark Badgett]

Something to consider regarding the fusion that is offered by middlesex/veteran/loyalist has a lock with a lower wider unbridled frizzen that is more correct for an earlier time period. If you are looking for an earlier fusion with a more correct lock india or rifle shoppe parts sets are your only options.

Here are the photos from Veterans and Loyalists English trade guns locks. Neither of these locks are correct, not even for a Belgian or later version with the pan bridle.

 

[Commodore Swab]

Here are the photos from Veterans and Loyalists English trade guns locks. Neither of these locks are correct, not even for a Belgian or later version with the pan bridle.

I was referring to the fusil. Sorry autocorrect turned it into fusion and I didn't catch it. The fusil lock looks nothing like their trade gun lock.

 

[Clark Badgett]

I was referring to the fusil. Sorry autocorrect turned it into fusion and I didn't catch it. The fusil lock looks nothing like their trade gun lock.

And here are the Fusil locks from Veterans and Loyalist followed by a correctly styled repro. Still not correct, and what is that hole looking thing behind the pan fence? Indian trigger guards are wrong too.

 

[Commodore Swab]

I guess you need to compare in person. The frizzen will be considerably wider as well as shorter. Something very difficult to see on a side profile. It's just an earlier style is all.

 

[Clark Badgett]

I guess you need to compare in person. The frizzen will be considerably wider as well as shorter. Something very difficult to see on a side profile. It's just an earlier style is all.

I’ll stick to looking at original guns.