when were toeplates first used?

[aragorn]

In the same vein as my previous question, about pin versus screw attachment for the triggerguard: if I'm building a York rifle of c 1770, would I be likely to attach a toeplate? Jim Chambers doesn't include one in his York kit, presumably for good reasons of authenticity, and I've read that toeplates first seem to appear on Pennsylvania rifles about this time. Any thoughts on this much appreciated.

One of the problems must be the attachment of toeplates later on to early rifles, for repair or embellishment, making it difficult to be certain what was there originally.

I read a lot about the practical aspect of toeplates, for protecting the stock, but is this really overstated - i.e., were they mainly there as embellishment, at a time when brass patchboxes were also appearing and gun decoration was becoming fancier? If they really are mainly practical, to protect the wood, it seems odd that they weren't used earlier (and I've never dinged my rifles there, touch wood!).

 

[brubincam]

iv seen guys break the toe off of modern rifles----why arent they used anymore? :yakyak: :yakyak: :yakyak:

 

[davy]

iv seen guys break the toe off of modern rifles----why arent they used anymore? :yakyak: :yakyak: :yakyak:

I agree ... mine was knocked off ... had to be repaired, and a toeplate installed! :cursing:

Davy

 

[Stophel]

If you want to use a toe plate, use it. If you don't, don't. Many of the known York guns from the 1780's-1790's (if they have them at all) have toeplates with plain square ends. Also, they are often very long, sometimes coming to within about 2" away from the rear triggerguard finial.

 

[Swampman]

Many guns of the 18th and 19th c. had no buttplate or toeplate and they still survive unbroken.

 

[Deadeye]

Depends a lot on how the grain runs in the toe area, if it runs across the toe it's going to break, better to put the plate on before it breaks.

 

[Swampman]

"Depends a lot on how the grain runs in the toe area"

I've found that if the grain runs wrong, they'll break even with a butt and toe plate (I've done it) :winking: . If we pick wood with the proper grain, neither are needed.

 

[spitfire]

"Depends a lot on how the grain runs in the toe area"

I've found that if the grain runs wrong, they'll break even with a butt and toe plate (I've done it) :winking: . If we pick wood with the proper grain, neither are needed.

I agree whole heartedly.My experience with the fancier grades of walnut(what I call "malestrom" burl crotch)is pretty to look at, not pratical in rough field use.I have seen cartridge toe traps on modern custom centerfire sporting rifles- albiet rarely-usually mauser variety with double set triggers and recreating a pre-WWII european sporter.Cost is a factor. :winking: